Thanks to Synchronet and some other software that I have experimented with over the past few months, I am thinking about getting into programming
for fun. If there is anyone out there who would like to give some
advise and or some help maybe point me in the right direction.
so if you have any ideas pass'em on will ya....thanks.
It might be a good idea to start with something like a Java SDK. No IDE, nothing. Just straight command-line edit/compile/run. Once you get the ba
Well, I looking for WEB many...but mostly I would like to learn how to make mods for my board.
I d/led java_ee_sdk-5_02-win.exe and installed it......
maybe its just me but I could find annthing in the docs or in my search. i guess i just not sure of what i should be looking for.
You may not know it yet, but your life is over.
Re: beginer level
By: Angus McLeod to Scottie on Mon Jul 30 2007 08:51 am
allll shit!
what the hell did i do?
is a system restore in my future?
if so; is there away around it? or what?
maybe its just me but I could find annthing in the docs or in my search. i guess i just not sure of what i should be looking for.
Learn Pascal!
I've found that when starting out, some of the best books (and cheapest) are the Sam's Teach Yourself <insert programming language name here> in 24 Hours Look for Sam's Teach Yourself Java in 24 Hours and I don't think you'll be disappointed.
That was the first language I learned in school after Apple BASIC. I blew m away that it didn't have line numbers!
I've found that when starting out, some of the best books (and cheapest) are the Sam's Teach Yourself <insert programming language name here> in 24 Hours. Look for Sam's Teach Yourself Java in 24 Hours and I don't think you'll be disappointed.
By "WEB", I guess you mean developing content for the WWW? In that case
you will need to learn a number of different and often contradictory languages. HTML of course, and CSS. Also PHP and Perl for server-side
and JavaScript for client-side code. And also some XML for AJAX-type functionality. And Java for your sins, but hopefully not. Then there is .NET and .ASP and so forth, so you can write non-portable backend code.
For the BBS, you could start with BAJA but since this is essentially a depreciated language, I would suggest jumping straight into JavaScript
with which you can code mods for the board. The 'jsexec' tool will let
you practise general, non-SBBS coding at the CLI. Later, this JS
knowledge will help when programming for WEB.
If you plan to do any serious programming, the first thing you need is a good text-editor. The text-editor is to the programmer what the hammer is to a carpenter. I use Kate at present, but on Windows platforms I use Crimson editor. Try out a few and settle on one you like. I think Syntax Highlighting and RE-fuelled search/replace are key features, and Code Folding can be nice too, but that is a personal choice.
So to recap, get yourself a good text-editor and start banging away at
some simple JavaScript.
I d/led java_ee_sdk-5_02-win.exe and installed it......
Noooooooooooooooooooooo!
:-/
You may not know it yet, but your life is over.
Re: beginer level
By: Scottie to All on Sun Jul 29 2007 07:31:00
Thanks to Synchronet and some other software that I have experimented wi over the past few months, I am thinking about getting into programming for fun. If there is anyone out there who would like to give some
advise and or some help maybe point me in the right direction.
There isn't a lot of 'fun' in programming, unless you end up with programs that are useful to you. So, why not tell us the type of program you were thinking of programming?
Re: beginer level
By: Corey to Scottie on Mon Jul 30 2007 20:03:00
Learn Pascal!
That was the first language I learned in school after Apple BASIC. I blew m away that it didn't have line numbers!
I beg to differ... Programming is nothing more then a logic puzzle, and
many folks enjoy such puzzles. When I first got into computers, it was on an ol' TRS-80 with BASIC. I'd write BASIC programs just to learn the
logic, and I'd say 90% didn't do anything very useful. Now, almost 20
years later, I'm writing business apps and websites, and for me that's fun.
For those who's forte is programming, it can be very fun :)
Same here, I picked-up Turbo Pascal for MS-DOS years ago, then worked with it on the old Mac Classics at school. Pascal was fun, and coming from
BASIC the line numbers, or lack of threw me as well. I wish Pascal was still a viable language, but I'd suggest starting with a language that can carry over to more currently platforms.
C++ is still very big, and I'd suggest that on any platform.
Oh yes he will. If he continues to waste time learning Java.....
That's the trick. Pascal is great to start with since it makes _sense_. Moving to object-oriented from Pascal, though, is an assault on the mind. Especially if it's your first exposure to programming. :)
Funny, I started with a more bare metal approach in learning C#.. my earlies reading on it was "C#: The Complete Reference" which was very dry, along wit using the command line compiler for everything with a text editor (crimson), wasn't until VS2005 I went mostly IDE.. I've used, and have to use vs2003 fo some work things, but vs2005 is pretty nice.
Angus McLeod wrote:
I d/led java_ee_sdk-5_02-win.exe and installed it......
Noooooooooooooooooooooo!
:-/
You may not know it yet, but your life is over.
Yeah, I threw up a little, in my mouth, when I first saw that line myself.
Java is just over complicated to implement imho...
That's something I don't have an answer for. Should a beginner start out wit procedural language or learn an OOP language right from the start?
Oh yes he will. If he continues to waste time learning Java.....
Alright Angus, I'll bite. What is wrong with Java, especially as a learning platform?
Whether he is using Linux, OS X, or Windows development tools are available and
free. Help and instruction is widely available. If one is comfortable with Java
then learning other languages such as C#, PHP, Perl (anything that can trace it's roots to C really) is fairly straight forward.
Don't get me wrong, if I were writing say and Windows app, I'd want to be using
C# .Net! But I think the bad taste Java left in some peoples mouths (insert joke here) was from earlier implementations. You can download Netbeans with Java 6 JDK in one setup file and be off and programming in a few clicks.
Whether he is using Linux, OS X, or Windows development tools are available and free. Help and instruction is widely available. If one is comfortable with Java then learning other languages such as C#, PHP, Perl (anything
that can trace it's roots to C really) is fairly straight forward.
That's something I don't have an answer for. Should a beginner start out with a procedural language or learn an OOP language right from the start?
Well, ASP.Net can be run under mod-mono with Apache... ;)
There isn't a lot of 'fun' in programming, unless you end up with program that are useful to you. So, why not tell us the type of program you were thinking of programming?
I beg to differ... Programming is nothing more then a logic puzzle, and
many folks enjoy such puzzles. When I first got into computers, it was on an ol' TRS-80 with BASIC. I'd write BASIC programs just to learn the
logic, and I'd say 90% didn't do anything very useful. Now, almost 20
years later, I'm writing business apps and websites, and for me that's fun.
For those who's forte is programming, it can be very fun :)
I original went from BASIC to COBOL to PASCAL to SmallTalk.
That's something I don't have an answer for. Should a beginner start out
with a procedural language or learn an OOP language right from the start?
OO from the start. If you get good at procedural, you'll never "get" OO.
Well, ASP.Net can be run under mod-mono with Apache... ;)
You can also shove hot embers up your ass. I never have, and don't plan
to start. :-)
You don't run into too many Smalltalk programmers...
Deuce wrote:
That's something I don't have an answer for. Should a beginner start out >> with a procedural language or learn an OOP language right from the start?
OO from the start. If you get good at procedural, you'll never "get" OO.
True enough.. can to this day "tell" when someone came from a procedural/mainframe background in terms of how they write their code.
Re: beginer level
By: Dennis to Trash80 on Tue Jul 31 2007 10:33:00
That's the trick. Pascal is great to start with since it makes _sense_. Moving to object-oriented from Pascal, though, is an assault on the mind. Especially if it's your first exposure to programming. :)
That's something I don't have an answer for. Should a beginner start out wit procedural language or learn an OOP language right from the start?
Re: beginer level
By: Trash80 to Dennis on Wed Aug 01 2007 06:27 am
That's something I don't have an answer for. Should a beginner start out with a procedural language or learn an OOP language right from the start?
OO from the start. If you get good at procedural, you'll never "get" OO.
Re: beginer level
By: Sam Alexander to Angus McLeod on Tue Jul 31 2007 10:59:00
There isn't a lot of 'fun' in programming, unless you end up with prog that are useful to you. So, why not tell us the type of program you w thinking of programming?
I beg to differ... Programming is nothing more then a logic puzzle, and many folks enjoy such puzzles. When I first got into computers, it was o an ol' TRS-80 with BASIC. I'd write BASIC programs just to learn the logic, and I'd say 90% didn't do anything very useful. Now, almost 20 years later, I'm writing business apps and websites, and for me that's fu
For those who's forte is programming, it can be very fun :)
I have made my living as a professional programmer for decades, and have been a hobby programmer as well, for all that time. Take it from me,
there is no 'fun' in writing *YET* another program to analyze someone
ELSES accounts. Ending up with a useful program isn't all that important,
I suppose. But you have to get *something* out of it, and for me that can be the pleasure of trying scary, cutting-edge new technology and not
ending up bleeding.
True enough.. can to this day "tell" when someone came from aThat's something I don't have an answer for. Should a beginner start out >>>> with a procedural language or learn an OOP language right from the start? >>>OO from the start. If you get good at procedural, you'll never "get" OO. >>
procedural/mainframe background in terms of how they write their code.
But can you "tell" when someone comes from a procedural/micro background? Or a
procedural/mini background? :-)
That's something I don't have an answer for. Should a beginner start out procedural language or learn an OOP language right from the start?
Doug, great question! I did procedural programming for years until last month when I was thrown into OOP with VB 2005. What I hate is most of the processes I picked-up with procedural coding are out the window with OOP
as it's a completely different way of writing code.
I think if someone were to choose, procedural might be simpler, but the future seems to be in OOP.
Sam
Re: Re: beginer levelI may try that one day, if i get a really bad case of hemeroids, as it
By: Tracker1 to Angus McLeod on Tue Jul 31 2007 08:35:00
Well, ASP.Net can be run under mod-mono with Apache... ;)
You can also shove hot embers up your ass. I never have, and don't plan
to start. :-)
True enough.. can to this day "tell" when someone came from a procedural/mainframe background in terms of how they write their code.
Re: Re: beginer level
By: Tracker1 to Deuce on Thu Aug 02 2007 01:09 am
True enough.. can to this day "tell" when someone came from a procedural/mainframe background in terms of how they write their code.
10 A = -1: IF A = 0 THEN 100
20 B = 2048+3
30 POKE B,0:POKE B+1,0
40 GOTO 10
50 END
100 PRINT "Now Did I modify My Own Self?"
110 END
Nope, couldn't identify a Procedural Programmer if it hit me in the face....
For me the hardest part is reinventing the way I write code. I first learned to code using BASIC on the TRS-80 Color Computer 2, then moved to QBasic and Turbo Pascal on MS-DOS, then ZBasic and Pascal on the Mac. THe last time I really did application coding (non-web) was Borland C++ 3.5 for MS-DOS, and that was at least 9 years ago or more.
Up until recently, I mainly did web coding (PHP, ColdFusion, etc), but that's kinda spoiled me. Now that I'm thrown back into application coding and on OOP at that with VB, it's like I'm starting from scratch again.I used to be a god at Perl and PHP.... Granted, I can still look at code
But OOP seems to be the way things are going, so best to learn now.
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