Ouch. :)
Not to fan the flames, but I've used a lot of distros and really ever since package repos got to be ubiquitous and everyones installers started being ea to use, everything has kinda felt the same. Sure some have one wm or the ot out of the box... but few of them really stand out as terribly different fro the next.
That said, I concede that Gentoo stands aside a little as... a little differ from the rest.
Ubuntu is pretty easy to use, although there are a couple of things that the still havent worked out yet. If they could get more gaming support I may swi back but after playing around with wine and cedega it just became too annoyi in the end.
I've been using Linux since Redhat 4.0 and Windows since 3.11 for workgroups and before that QEMM running DOS for the BBS and good ol' desqview so I coul have multinode... man that was unstable. I'd have to say my favorite OS of t bunch would be Windows 7. It's clean, fast, I have had no issues (apart from some old scanner but meh).
The open source drivers existed before official support for the OS appeared from the vendor. The default nv driver still isn't supported by nVidia. No positive of the state of ATI, but last I looked, they were a lot more open (read "not the guys writing the drivers").
I'm not getting defensive. I think that probably 75% of windows users would switch to ubuntu if they tried it & had someone who knew the majority of it' features show them what amazing stuff they can do with it.
Re: Re: NTLDR
By: Rassilon to Access Denied on Mon Mar 29 2010 21:47:00
I'm not getting defensive. I think that probably 75% of windows users wo switch to ubuntu if they tried it & had someone who knew the majority of features show them what amazing stuff they can do with it.
I tried Ubuntu recently (about a year ago) and I think it was getting pretty slick but still needs some polishing. Whatever default GUI I was using was bit messy and not as intuitive as it would need to be before 75% of typical users could handle it day to day. Maybe it's improved since then, maybe you overestimating the average user.
echicken
electronic chicken bbs - bbs.electronicchicken.com - 416-273-7230
Then again, if you're any kind of gamer, or like playing the new stuff that comes out.. you're forced to stick with Windows most of the time because noo besides Linux nuts want to make anything for Linux. *shrug*
I tried Ubuntu recently (about a year ago) and I think it was getting pretty slick but still needs some polishing. Whatever default GUI I was using was bit messy and not as intuitive as it would need to be before 75% of typical users could handle it day to day. Maybe it's improved since then, maybe you overestimating the average user.
And when you use the open source drivers then open more than two windows at once it locks up? Yeah no thanks. Windows seems to keep their working code i
Well, I haven't used any other linux distros so I don't know if it's the mos like windows...and if it is the most like windows then windows is SERIOUSLY LACKING. Ubuntu does sooo much more than Windows could ever dream of.
I'm not getting defensive. I think that probably 75% of windows users would switch to ubuntu if they tried it & had someone who knew the majority of it' features show them what amazing stuff they can do with it.
Ya, I know. That's the one thing that sucks about linux. That's why I've g XP on a dual boot...I have it if I need it...never use it, but it's there... have old games on my XP partition that I used to play.
Never had that happen with any video card.
Re: Re: NTLDR
By: Access Denied to Dotcom on Mon Mar 29 2010 06:13 pm
Then again, if you're any kind of gamer, or like playing the new stuff th comes out.. you're forced to stick with Windows most of the time because besides Linux nuts want to make anything for Linux. *shrug*
Ya, I know. That's the one thing that sucks about linux. That's why I've g XP on a dual boot...I have it if I need it...never use it, but it's there... have old games on my XP partition that I used to play.
-Rassilon...
have you tryed the one that came from the redhat source?Fedora Core, CentOS, & I'm sure that there are others. RedHat goes WAY back, so there are bound to be many spin-offs.
I think it's call centos or something.
I have gaming consoles for games, computers for computing. Linux/Unix works designed as does my Xbox & NES :)
SERIOUSLY LACKING. Ubuntu does sooo much more than Windows could ever dream of.
Like what, exactly?
Are you a gamer of any sort? Wine and Cedega friggin blow.
And when their video card on a laptop becomes unsupported for linux because ATI or NVIDIA want to get rid of older code? Windows versions keep that code.
Ya, I know. That's the one thing that sucks about linux. That's why I've g XP on a dual boot...I have it if I need it...never use it, but it's there... have old games on my XP partition that I used to play.
And the truth comes out.. :)
I have gaming consoles for games, computers for computing. Linux/Unix
works as designed as does my Xbox & NES :)
-#2pencil-
Re: Re: NTLDR
By: Access Denied to Rassilon on Wed Mar 31 2010 06:27 pm
Ya, I know. That's the one thing that sucks about linux. That's why I've g XP on a dual boot...I have it if I need it...never use it, but it's there... have old games on my XP partition that I used to play.
And the truth comes out.. :)
Big deal. Ubuntu isn't a GAMING operating system. As I said, I don't game. And when I feel like it I either use my laptop (which is now always running synchronet) or boot into Windows.
-Rassilon...
The Citadel BBS - telnet://citadel.synchro.net (PORT 4000) - Sci-Fi / Fanta / Role Playing...
have you tried the server kernel?
Re: Re: NTLDR
By: No2pencil to Rassilon on Thu Apr 01 2010 02:21 am
I have gaming consoles for games, computers for computing. Linux/Unix wo designed as does my Xbox & NES :)
Windows on a good computer is way better than Xbox.
For me of course, Xbox is "good enough" though.
I'd have to say comparing gaming on a console i.e. xbox/xbox 360/PS2/PS3
and gaming on an up to date PC, the PC makes the console appear a step or two behind.
Don't get me wrong I like to play on consoles alot but I get more out of a PC. Plus I dont have to contend with MS or Sony changing the ball game whenever they like. Which seems to be more and more common now that
consoles are connected to the internet.
Well, for one Ubuntu is a million times faster. When I boot off my linux partition it takes about 30 seconds to boot. When I boot off my Windows partition it takes 3+ minutes to boot.
Secondly, there is so much really cool **FREE** software for Ubuntu. It's a real development OS.
And more, Ubuntu almost never crashes for any reason. I run with four deskt full of running programs all the time and as long as I keep those programs running un-maximized or minimized, Ubuntu runs just as fast as if I only hav browser and telnet client running.
No, I'm not a gamer at all. The last time I did any kind of gaming was abou year ago when I moved in with my girlfriend and she had a bunch of games tha found interesting. Got burnt out fast.
And ya, WINE blows - but at least Linux is doing something to TRY to support Windows, that's better than anything you can say for microsoft.
I've never heard of anyone not being able to get an older laptop video drive Worst case scenario is that it would work - and work well - but you wouldn't able to get any advanced video effects, which you really don't need anyway.
Big deal. Ubuntu isn't a GAMING operating system. As I said, I don't game. And when I feel like it I either use my laptop (which is now always running synchronet) or boot into Windows.
Re: Re: NTLDR
By: Rassilon to Access Denied on Thu Apr 01 2010 11:21 pm
Well, for one Ubuntu is a million times faster. When I boot off my linux partition it takes about 30 seconds to boot. When I boot off my Windows partition it takes 3+ minutes to boot.
That's odd, it only takes about 20-30 seconds for both of my desktops to loa Windows 7. That and I don't think I've ever had it take more than a minute t load any Windows version I've ever used.
I've also ran Ubuntu before, and never noticed any speed difference, since Ubuntu loads a bunch of cruft when booting just like Windows does. You just seem to be using typical fanboy excuses here.
Secondly, there is so much really cool **FREE** software for Ubuntu. It' real development OS.
Even more odd, a lot of that free software is also available on Windows. Granted there's software out there you can pay for (if you really want to) a well. All your normal things you would load onto a desktop (ie: browser, ema cient, office suite, torrent client, media players, whatever.. 90% of the go ones are available on both OSes.
And more, Ubuntu almost never crashes for any reason. I run with four de full of running programs all the time and as long as I keep those program running un-maximized or minimized, Ubuntu runs just as fast as if I only browser and telnet client running.
And I've never had Windows 7 crash on me, either. I run it on two desktops currently, one of them is running SBBS, which is what.. like 8 servers in on Plus an IRC client open, a Torrent client running, flash policy server, and antivirus all at the same time. The only time it gets shut off is when I hav to restart due to an update (which Ubuntu does, as well). So I still have ye to see your point. Ubuntu is no better than Windows or OSX. They're all bloa OSes that offer the most, but don't run the fastest.
If you were trying to argue with me about like BSD, Debian, Slack, Gentoo, o something that comes with no bloat, I wouldn't be arguing. But all you're do is talking up /your personal/ favorite OS. Your reasoning isn't really helpi your argument one bit. Ubuntu is one of, if not the most bloated Linux OS ou there.
No, I'm not a gamer at all. The last time I did any kind of gaming was a year ago when I moved in with my girlfriend and she had a bunch of games found interesting. Got burnt out fast.
Which is totally fine. I didn't play any computer games for probably 10 year I finally got a computer fast enough to play the newest ones that are coming out, and I kinda got back into it. Who knows how long it will last, but it's fun while it lasts. I have realized though, that PC gaming is WAY better graphics than consoles (of course, if you have the hardware to run these gam on max settings).
And ya, WINE blows - but at least Linux is doing something to TRY to supp Windows, that's better than anything you can say for microsoft.
Linux, afaik, has nothing to do with WINE. Wine has it's own developers, jus like any other software out there, usually.
Microsoft doesn't make ATARI, AMIGA, NES, SNES, SEGA, NEOGEO, TG16, PS, PS2, PS3, XBOX, and XBOX360 (probably missing a bunch, but I figure with that man you'll get my point) emulators for their OS, but rather, other developers ma every one of those that can be used on Windows.
Windows doesn't TRY to support Linux, just like Linux doesn't TRY to support Windows. The developers are the ones that make things happen, and where you have Wine for linux.. a quick google search reveals that there indeed ARE Linux emulators out there, and quite a few actually.
I've never heard of anyone not being able to get an older laptop video dr Worst case scenario is that it would work - and work well - but you would able to get any advanced video effects, which you really don't need anywa
Sure, you can always grab the drivers. But then good luck EVER trying to upd your computer again, with that Linux distro, and all the dependencies that c with it. Again, maybe you wouldn't have this problem with Slackware, but you will definitely have it with Ubuntu.
axisd
my win 7 on my netbook with 2 gigs ram and a atom n270 cpu takes like less t a minute to load.
Re: Re: NTLDR
By: Corey to Access Denied on Fri Apr 02 2010 09:01 pm
my win 7 on my netbook with 2 gigs ram and a atom n270 cpu takes like les a minute to load.
Is that good? I've never tinkered with a netbook. Are they usually slower th desktops?
axisd
Why would it not be? Have you ever looked in the Ubuntu repositories? It's definitely not a DEVELOPMENT operating system either. It's made to be an "all around" OS, otherwise it would still be packaged as DEBIAN.
my win 7 on my netbook with 2 gigs ram and a atom n270 cpu takes like less than a minute to load.
Re: Re: NTLDR
By: Corey to Access Denied on Fri Apr 02 2010 09:01 pm
my win 7 on my netbook with 2 gigs ram and a atom n270 cpu takes like les than a minute to load.
Well, they must have done something right about Windows 7 then. I've only heard people saying good things about it.
My friend has a brand new (not sure of the speed but pretty damn fast - fast than mine) & Windows Vista takes about 4 or 5 minutes to boot on that system
-Rassilon...
The Citadel BBS - telnet://citadel.synchro.net (PORT 4000) - Sci-Fi / Fanta / Role Playing...
Re: Re: NTLDR
By: Corey to Access Denied on Fri Apr 02 2010 09:01 pm
my win 7 on my netbook with 2 gigs ram and a atom n270 cpu takes like less than a minute to load.
Well, they must have done something right about Windows 7 then. I've only heard people saying good things about it.
My friend has a brand new (not sure of the speed but pretty damn fast - faster
than mine) & Windows Vista takes about 4 or 5 minutes to boot on that system.
Why would it not be? Have you ever looked in the Ubuntu repositories? It' definitely not a DEVELOPMENT operating system either. It's made to be an "all around" OS, otherwise it would still be packaged as DEBIAN.
Uhm, it *IS* Debian.
Well, I can't say I agree with you...all the games I've played on an up-to-d designated game system are way better than PC games.
Uhm, it *IS* Debian.
Uhm, it *IS* Debian.
Indeed it is, all Ubuntu have done is take the unstable tree from debian, photo shop a few logo's and voila a new distro - they hardly ever
contribute to the kernel tree unlike other distro's Debian, RedHat, SuSE
etc etc - good on Ubuntu for giving more exposure, but shame on you for not contributing back to the whole linux drive.
Re: Re: NTLDR
By: Rassilon to Lurch on Fri Apr 02 2010 02:38 pm
Well, I can't say I agree with you...all the games I've played on an up-to-d
designated game system are way better than PC games.
Tye the same game on an up-to-date designated PC system.
Re: Re: NTLDR
By: Rassilon to Lurch on Fri Apr 02 2010 02:38 pm
Well, I can't say I agree with you...all the games I've played on an up-t designated game system are way better than PC games.
Tye the same game on an up-to-date designated PC system.
I'm not getting defensive. I think that probably 75% of windows users would switch to ubuntu if they tried it& had someone who knew the majority of it's features show them what amazing stuff they can do with it.
Yeah, to be honest, the newest version of Ubunutu (9.10 Karmic Koala) has been
a bit of a let down...when it first came out there were lots of bugs but all the recent updates have taken care of all the problems I had to begin with.
9.04 (the last version) was solid from start to finish. I believe that was probably the best kernel I've seen.
And ya, you're right. I do overestimate the average user.
Well, for one Ubuntu is a million times faster. When I boot off my linux partition it takes about 30 seconds to boot. When I boot off my Windows partition it takes 3+ minutes to boot.
Secondly, there is so much really cool **FREE** software for Ubuntu. It's a real development OS.
And more, Ubuntu almost never crashes for any reason. I run with four desktops
full of running programs all the time and as long as I keep those programs running un-maximized or minimized, Ubuntu runs just as fast as if I only have a
browser and telnet client running.
No, I'm not a gamer at all. The last time I did any kind of gaming was about a
year ago when I moved in with my girlfriend and she had a bunch of games that I
found interesting. Got burnt out fast.
That, and I've been getting into these BBS Door games recently.
And ya, WINE blows - but at least Linux is doing something to TRY to support Windows, that's better than anything you can say for microsoft.
And when their video card on a laptop becomes unsupported for linux because >> ATI or NVIDIA want to get rid of older code? Windows versions keep that
code.
I've never heard of anyone not being able to get an older laptop video driver.
Worst case scenario is that it would work - and work well - but you wouldn't be
able to get any advanced video effects, which you really don't need anyway.
I converted 5 people to Ubuntu, 3 converted back in less than a month, 1 after about 8 months, the other switched back to windows after a new computer 14 months later...
I've seen it a few times... Though imho wireless drivers on laptops are the single biggest point of pain/fail.
I've seen it a few times... Though imho wireless drivers on laptops are the >> single biggest point of pain/fail.
TELL ME ABOUT IT! Ya, wireless laptop drivers are a b*tch to get working on ubuntu...that damn ndiswrapper.
But I've done it so many times now I've got it down to a science.
Since 8.10 (more in 9.04) they have a lot of wireless driver modules
loading at boot, typically you'll have a driver it thinks is right that you need to disable to get ndiswrapper to work right. Yeah, I haven't done it as much since 9.04...
And when you use the open source drivers then open more than two windows at once it locks up? Yeah no thanks. Windows seems to keep their working code in the driver packages for older hardware, and Linux decides to make a "Legacy Driver" package,
And when you use the open source drivers then open more than two windows once it locks up? Yeah no thanks. Windows seems to keep their working cod in the driver packages for older hardware, and Linux decides to make a "Legacy Driver" package,
An issue caused by nVidia, not "Linux"...
Re: Re: NTLDR
By: Access Denied to Jame on Tue May 04 2010 21:09:00
Ya...I just discovered that I'm having a problem with the new ubuntu 9.10. I've got a brand new ati video card that was supported in 9.04, but since I' upgraded to 9.10 I can't get out of low res & I have no video effects. Real pissing me off. I might just go back to 9.04.
-Rassilon...
Ya...I just discovered that I'm having a problem with the new ubuntu 9.10. I've got a brand new ati video card that was supported in 9.04, but since I' upgraded to 9.10 I can't get out of low res & I have no video effects. Real pissing me off. I might just go back to 9.04.
yeah, someone told me the new versions have a bunch of buggys in them.
I will keep my 9.04 for now.
If it's a newer card, you probably just have to wait till the ati-drivers package is updated. Should follow soon after a new release (especially a release as large as *buntu).
Or, throw in the 9.04 repositories, and install the video drivers from there think that used to work in the past as well. Your best bet is to hit up the Ubuntu forums, I'm sure someone has already posted about it there.
Re: Re: NTLDR
By: Corey to Rassilon on Mon May 17 2010 12:09:40
yeah, someone told me the new versions have a bunch of buggys in them.
I will keep my 9.04 for now.
Yeah, I wish I had. Lucky I still have 9.04 on my laptop.
-Rassilon...
Well, even with 9.04 I had to install the generic linux drivers. So, when I upgraded to the new version & my video effects weren't working, the first th I did was try to reinstall them. When I did - no change. Pissed me off.
Ya, & I get all my Ubuntu updates / upgrades for free! AND it's a far superior operating system...
Yep. All up until ATI or Nvidia decides to not support your video card on li anymore. Then, well.. you're fucked.
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