Opera launches new browser war with Microsoft

http://www.cbc.ca/technology/story/2007/12/13/tech-opera.html

Looks like Microslobs is in trouble again it seems. LOL! Nothing new there.
$ The Millionaire $
Park Avenue Place
Surrey, B.C., Canada Û*Û

---
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Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: The Millionaire to All on Wed Jan 02 2008 02:32 pm

Opera launches new browser war with Microsoft

http://www.cbc.ca/technology/story/2007/12/13/tech-opera.html

Looks like Microslobs is in trouble again it seems. LOL! Nothing new there.
$ The Millionaire $
Park Avenue Place
Surrey, B.C., Canada Û*Û

Can you say pipe dream?

Dirty Jack Rackham...A.K.A: Ralph Smole
www.bullishmcgee.com
www.ralphsmole.com
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Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: The Millionaire to All on Wed Jan 02 2008 02:32 pm

Opera launches new browser war with Microsoft

Opera actually has a good browser. I still can't wean myself away from
Firefox though.


---
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Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: Killroy to The Millionaire on Wed Jan 02 2008 08:37 pm

Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: The Millionaire to All on Wed Jan 02 2008 02:32 pm

Opera launches new browser war with Microsoft

Opera actually has a good browser. I still can't wean myself away from Firefox though.

It's really competitive between the two, isn't it? I mean I've gotten used to Firefox for a while now. I've used Opera a few times and it's not bad though.
$ The Millionaire $
Park Avenue Place
Surrey, B.C., Canada Û*Û

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Killroy spoke thus to The Millionaire <=-

Opera actually has a good browser. I still can't wean myself
away from Firefox though.

:) I've never tried Opera but I've been using Firefox for a very
long time and prefer it to Microsoft Internet Explorer. :)


ÚÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄ¿
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³ ghintz@mchsi.com ³
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Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: Killroy to The Millionaire on Wed Jan 02 2008 08:37 pm

Opera launches new browser war with Microsoft

Opera actually has a good browser. I still can't wean myself away from Firefox though.

I sorta like Opera, but there's just something about it that I can't quite get used to. It's usually speedier and better on resource usage than Firefox, but, Firefox 3 is a tremendous improvement in that arena.

-- MysticOne

---
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Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: MysticOne to Killroy on Thu Jan 03 2008 02:42 am

Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: Killroy to The Millionaire on Wed Jan 02 2008 08:37 pm

Opera launches new browser war with Microsoft

Opera actually has a good browser. I still can't wean myself away from Firefox though.

I sorta like Opera, but there's just something about it that I can't quite get used to. It's usually speedier and better on resource usage than Firefox, but, Firefox 3 is a tremendous improvement in that arena.

-- MysticOne

Firefox 3 isn't out yet. I'm still using 2 at the moment.
$ The Millionaire $
Park Avenue Place
Surrey, B.C., Canada Û*Û

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Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: The Millionaire to MysticOne on Thu Jan 03 2008 07:48 am

Firefox 3 isn't out yet. I'm still using 2 at the moment.

Sure it is. It is in Beta Testing.

http://www.mozilla.com/en-US/firefox/3.0b1/releasenotes/


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Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: W8ZZU to The Millionaire on Thu Jan 03 2008 11:37 am

Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: The Millionaire to MysticOne on Thu Jan 03 2008 07:48 am

Firefox 3 isn't out yet. I'm still using 2 at the moment.

Sure it is. It is in Beta Testing.

http://www.mozilla.com/en-US/firefox/3.0b1/releasenotes/

Jason - W8ZZU
Total Logged Contacts = 1620
Last Contact: K2BET on 40 CW. Location: MI. 12/15/07 at 19:21 UTC

Well I never use beta until I see the complete version.
$ The Millionaire $
Park Avenue Place
Surrey, B.C., Canada Û*Û

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To: The Curmudgeon

:) I've never tried Opera but I've been using Firefox for a very
long time and prefer it to Microsoft Internet Explorer. :)

yeah, opera is comparable to firefox, except FF has better addons.

firefox still has those memory leaks, though.

.Ä.Ú Â Â ÂÂ.Ä. ÂÚ¿
-³ ³Ã¿³ ³³ ³³³ ³³ ³À¿-
`Ä'ÀÙÁÙÁ`\/'Á`Ä'À-ÙÀÙ
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* Data Stream - garland texas - telnet://dsbbs.synchro.net
þ Synchronet þ Vertrauen þ Home of Synchronet þ telnet://vert.synchro.net

Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: The Millionaire to W8ZZU on Thu Jan 03 2008 09:39 am

Well I never use beta until I see the complete version.

You want to explain to me why exactly??

Terry

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Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: Death to The Millionaire on Thu Jan 03 2008 02:38 pm

Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: The Millionaire to W8ZZU on Thu Jan 03 2008 09:39 am

Well I never use beta until I see the complete version.

You want to explain to me why exactly??

Terry

Um, because for 1, they are full of bugs and unstable.
$ The Millionaire $
Park Avenue Place
Surrey, B.C., Canada Û*Û

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Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: Killroy to The Millionaire on Wed Jan 02 2008 20:37:00

Opera actually has a good browser. I still can't wean myself away from Firefox though.

Same here. I keep trying Opera every year or so and am impressed yet for some reason still prefer FireFox. Opera did invent tabbed browsing though and are known for having the only 100% compliant (with standards) browser.

Regards,
Doug
--
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FidoNet: 1:255/36 Internet: theville.vintagecomputing.net

---
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Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: The Millionaire to Death on Thu Jan 03 2008 12:01 pm

Um, because for 1, they are full of bugs and unstable.

Wow...glad everyone doesn't have your attitude on that.. Every program made would stay in Beta...

Terry

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þ Synchronet þ Darkness BBS - darkness.synchro.net

Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: The Millionaire to W8ZZU on Thu Jan 03 2008 09:39 am

Firefox 3 isn't out yet. I'm still using 2 at the moment.

Sure it is. It is in Beta Testing.

http://www.mozilla.com/en-US/firefox/3.0b1/releasenotes/

Well I never use beta until I see the complete version.

...but thats not the point.. The point is that you said it wasn't out yet.

You probably shouldn't be using Synchronet then because we are all beta testers. <shrug>


Jason - W8ZZU
Total Logged Contacts = 1620
Last Contact: K2BET on 40 CW. Location: MI. 12/15/07 at 19:21 UTC

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Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: W8ZZU to The Millionaire on Thu Jan 03 2008 09:09 pm

Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: The Millionaire to W8ZZU on Thu Jan 03 2008 09:39 am

Firefox 3 isn't out yet. I'm still using 2 at the moment.

Sure it is. It is in Beta Testing.

http://www.mozilla.com/en-US/firefox/3.0b1/releasenotes/

Well I never use beta until I see the complete version.

...but thats not the point.. The point is that you said it wasn't out yet.

You probably shouldn't be using Synchronet then because we are all beta testers. <shrug>

*Sighs*
$ The Millionaire $
Park Avenue Place
Surrey, B.C., Canada Û*Û

---
þ Synchronet þ Park Avenue Place - parkave.synchro.net:81

Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: MysticOne to Killroy on Thu Jan 03 2008 02:42 am

I sorta like Opera, but there's just something about it that I can't quite get used to. It's usually speedier and better on resource usage than Firefox, but, Firefox 3 is a tremendous improvement in that arena.

I love opera and any time I need a browser only, it's what I prefer. The mail client stinks to high heaven though.

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Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: Trash80 to Killroy on Thu Jan 03 2008 04:33 pm

Same here. I keep trying Opera every year or so and am impressed yet for some reason still prefer FireFox. Opera did invent tabbed browsing though and are known for having the only 100% compliant (with standards) browser.

I'm not sure that Opera invented tabbed browsing... I seem to recall someone else doing that. And it's most definatly not 100% compliant... I myself have submitted non-compliance bug reports. As an example, if a web server advertises both Basic and Digest authentication as per RFC2617 and puts Basic first as reccomended by RFC2617, Opera does not use Digest auth as required by RFC2617. In fact, no browser seems to.

---
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Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: W8ZZU to The Millionaire on Thu Jan 03 2008 09:09 pm

You probably shouldn't be using Synchronet then because we are all beta testers. <shrug>

There are non-beta releases of Synchronet.

---
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//- With quil in hand, Finnigann
sends off a short note to Deuce, about Opera Vs. Microsoft? -\\

Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: Trash80 to Killroy on Thu Jan 03 2008 04:33 pm

Same here. I keep trying Opera every year or so and am impressed yet for some reason still prefer FireFox. Opera did invent tabbed browsing though and are known for having the only 100% compliant (with standards) browser.

I'm not sure that Opera invented tabbed browsing... I seem to recall someone else doing that. And it's most definatly not 100% compliant...
I myself have submitted non-compliance bug reports. As an example, if
a web server advertises both Basic and Digest authentication as per RFC2617 and puts Basic first as reccomended by RFC2617, Opera does not
use Digest auth as required by RFC2617. In fact, no browser seems to.

Not much of a standard then...



When you make the finding yourself - even if
you're the last person on Earth to see the
light - you'll never forget it. -- Carl Sagan


... Frankly, Scallop, I Don't Give a Clam
--- MultiMail/Win32 v0.47
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Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: The Millionaire to MysticOne on Thu Jan 03 2008 07:48 am

I sorta like Opera, but there's just something about it that I can't quite get used to. It's usually speedier and better on resource usage than Firefox, but, Firefox 3 is a tremendous improvement in that arena.

Firefox 3 isn't out yet. I'm still using 2 at the moment.

There have been some beta releases of 3. I have one of the portable versions from portableapps.com on my thumbdrive. The speed difference and memory usage reductions are incredible, but, it's still a bit crashy and not all the extensions I use are supported.

-- MysticOne

---
þ Synchronet þ :: The Realm of Dreams :: telnet://bbs.mysticone.com

Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: Deuce to MysticOne on Fri Jan 04 2008 12:53 am

I love opera and any time I need a browser only, it's what I prefer. The mail client stinks to high heaven though.

I've not used the mail client, but I'll use the browser a bit from time to time. I like it, it's fast and it works pretty well. But there's something about the way it "feels" that always seems to annoy me, and I never can use it for very long. I'm hoping I'll figure out what bugs me someday, and then maybe I can fix it or Opera will fix it and I can just be happy with it. :)

-- MysticOne

---
þ Synchronet þ :: The Realm of Dreams :: telnet://bbs.mysticone.com

Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: The Millionaire to W8ZZU on Thu Jan 03 2008 10:54 pm

Well I never use beta until I see the complete version.

...but thats not the point.. The point is that you said it wasn't out yet.

You probably shouldn't be using Synchronet then because we are all beta testers. <shrug>

*Sighs*

Boy, you really don't like to be told the truth, do you?


Jason - W8ZZU
Total Logged Contacts = 1620
Last Contact: K2BET on 40 CW. Location: MI. 12/15/07 at 19:21 UTC

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Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: MysticOne to The Millionaire on Fri Jan 04 2008 07:37 am

Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: The Millionaire to MysticOne on Thu Jan 03 2008 07:48 am

I sorta like Opera, but there's just something about it that I can't quite get used to. It's usually speedier and better on resource
usage than Firefox, but, Firefox 3 is a tremendous improvement in
that arena.

Firefox 3 isn't out yet. I'm still using 2 at the moment.

There have been some beta releases of 3. I have one of the portable versions from portableapps.com on my thumbdrive. The speed difference and memory usage reductions are incredible, but, it's still a bit crashy and
not all the extensions I use are supported.

-- MysticOne

I did get a copy of it now. I will take a look at it and give you my opinion of it in a few days.
$ The Millionaire $
Park Avenue Place
Surrey, B.C., Canada Û*Û

---
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Re: Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: Finnigann to Deuce on Fri Jan 04 2008 10:36 am

I'm not sure that Opera invented tabbed browsing... I seem to recall someone else doing that. And it's most definatly not 100%
compliant... I myself have submitted non-compliance bug reports. As
an example, if
a web server advertises both Basic and Digest authentication as per RFC2617 and puts Basic first as reccomended by RFC2617, Opera does not use Digest auth as required by RFC2617. In fact, no browser seems to.

Not much of a standard then...

Though, as a point of contention, RFCs aren't standards. They're just wannabe standards that never grew up. :) Some people follow them religiously, but others don't.

-- MysticOne

---
þ Synchronet þ :: The Realm of Dreams :: telnet://bbs.mysticone.com

Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: Deuce to W8ZZU on Fri Jan 04 2008 12:59 am

You probably shouldn't be using Synchronet then because we are all beta testers. <shrug>

There are non-beta releases of Synchronet.

True, but he is using a beta release and he states he never uses beta software. Yet he is currently "trying" to get support for an FTP issue with his beta software.


Jason - W8ZZU
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Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: The Millionaire to MysticOne on Fri Jan 04 2008 02:26 pm

I did get a copy of it now. I will take a look at it and give you my
opinion of it in a few days.

A five paragraph essay should be sufficient. :)

-- MysticOne

---
þ Synchronet þ :: The Realm of Dreams :: telnet://bbs.mysticone.com

Re: Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: Finnigann to Deuce on Fri Jan 04 2008 10:36 am

though and are known for having the only 100% compliant (with standards) browser.

someone else doing that. And it's most definatly not 100%
compliant... I myself have submitted non-compliance bug reports. As

Not much of a standard then...

*blink*

*blink*

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Re: Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: MysticOne to Finnigann on Fri Jan 04 2008 12:15 pm

Not much of a standard then...

Though, as a point of contention, RFCs aren't standards. They're just wannabe standards that never grew up. :) Some people follow them religiously, but others don't.

Hrm... so the concept of a standard compliant browser is moot since there is no HTTP standard.

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To: Trash80
> Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?

By: Killroy to The Millionaire on Wed Jan 02 2008 20:37:00

Opera actually has a good browser. I still can't wean myself away from Firefox though.

Same here. I keep trying Opera every year or so and am impressed yet for som reason still prefer FireFox. Opera did invent tabbed browsing though and are

yeah, i feel exactly the same way.
opera is a good browser, but i dont really use it.

also, like deuce said the mail feature in it really sucks, they should take
it out.

.Ä.Ú Â Â ÂÂ.Ä. ÂÚ¿
-³ ³Ã¿³ ³³ ³³³ ³³ ³À¿-
`Ä'ÀÙÁÙÁ`\/'Á`Ä'À-ÙÀÙ
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|05a zer0net node
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* Data Stream - garland texas - telnet://dsbbs.synchro.net
þ Synchronet þ Vertrauen þ Home of Synchronet þ telnet://vert.synchro.net

To: MysticOne
> time. I like it, it's fast and it works pretty well. But there's something

about the way it "feels" that always seems to annoy me, and I never can use for very long. I'm hoping I'll figure out what bugs me someday, and then ma I can fix it or Opera will fix it and I can just be happy with it. :)

yes, it's very fast and i too share this weird feeling that it bugs me.
wonder what it is. maybe because it used to be a pay browser?
maybe it's those goofy myspacey ads they used to have on their site with models that fit certain personality stereotypes

.Ä.Ú Â Â ÂÂ.Ä. ÂÚ¿
-³ ³Ã¿³ ³³ ³³³ ³³ ³À¿-
`Ä'ÀÙÁÙÁ`\/'Á`Ä'À-ÙÀÙ
+o edge of oblivion bbs þ eob-bbs.com
|04An underground bbs with tons of the best games+files
|05a zer0net node
--- Synchronet 3.14a-Win32 NewsLink 1.85
* Data Stream - garland texas - telnet://dsbbs.synchro.net
þ Synchronet þ Vertrauen þ Home of Synchronet þ telnet://vert.synchro.net

//- With quil in hand, Finnigann
sends off a short note to Deuce, about Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft? -\\

Re: Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: Finnigann to Deuce on Fri Jan 04 2008 10:36 am

though and are known for having the only 100% compliant (with standards) browser.

someone else doing that. And it's most definatly not 100%
compliant... I myself have submitted non-compliance bug reports. As

Not much of a standard then...

*blink*

*blink*

I was under the impression EVERYONE worked to meet those guidelines.

Guess I can add that to the list of things I *thought* I knew...



When you make the finding yourself - even if
you're the last person on Earth to see the
light - you'll never forget it. -- Carl Sagan


... 2 + 2 = 5 for extremely large values of 2.
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Re: Re: Opera Vs. Microsoft?
By: Deuce to MysticOne on Fri Jan 04 2008 05:08 pm

Hrm... so the concept of a standard compliant browser is moot since there
is no HTTP standard.

I think a "standards compliant browser" refers more to the W3C stuff than anything else. A lot of the RFCs are de facto standards nowadays, but, they're technically not official standards.

-- MysticOne

---
þ Synchronet þ :: The Realm of Dreams :: telnet://bbs.mysticone.com

On 1/3/2008 9:33 AM, Trash80 wrote:

Opera actually has a good browser. I still can't wean myself away from
Firefox though.

Same here. I keep trying Opera every year or so and am impressed yet for some reason still prefer FireFox. Opera did invent tabbed browsing though and are known for having the only 100% compliant (with standards) browser.

They aren't fully compliant.. no browser is CSS2 compliant simply because parts of the spec are stupid, and incredibly difficult to technically achieve... which is why CSS2.1 is actually a slightly lighter standard.

Still Opera doesn't fully comply on that level.. what is was is the first to pass the ACID2 test (which isn't a standard), it's a reference rendering of some of the more complex features of CSS2.

Webkit (Apple, based on KHTML) was iirc, second to do this... Firefox3 is close (done?) and afaik it's a checkbox target for IE8... however, making adjustments *JUST* for the acid2 test is a mistake, and may take away for more pressing bugs in rendering against CSS2... Also, there's the new X/HTML specs which look to be a bit of a break from the current versions on the horizon...

The number of AJAX, really DHTML+AJAX frameworks out there is growing rapidly, each with overlapping functionality, conflicting naming conventions, and just plain difficult to make work together. Who knows what will happen next... I am both dreading and eagerly awaiting what's ahead.

--
Michael J. Ryan - tracker1(at)theroughnecks(dot)net - www.theroughnecks.net icq: 4935386 - AIM/AOL: azTracker1 - Y!: azTracker1 - MSN/Win: (email)

... FRA #121: Everything is for sale, even friendship.

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On 1/4/2008 10:34 PM, Finnigann wrote:

I was under the impression EVERYONE worked to meet those guidelines.

Guess I can add that to the list of things I *thought* I knew...

Some standards are more technically difficult than others... or at least portions of a standard.. the text-to-speach portions of CSS2 for example, simply because they are difficult to implement, and don't play well with many text2speach readers as it is... so lower priority is set to those portions of integration, because the actual software doing the rendering is outside the browser in question...

Others are of higher demand, or more crucial... something used on a high profile site, that is broken.

This whittles itself down to what gets implemented or fixed, and what does not... there are also ego issues, like the acid2 test, that many will work towards, as that's now considered the golden cockring for browsers.

This is in addition to upcoming standards that tend to break away, and/or more clearly define implementations which break the look/feel of how sites are rendered now... do you correct things and force a slew of changes online, or leave the X billion web pages working as designed as is?

It's not always cut and dry as to "comply with standards"... a boss around 2001 wanted me to create a "standards compliant" site.. that didn't look right in IE5 or Netscape at the time (IE5 was okay).. why, because of NN's broken table whitespace, and a few issues with IE at the time. It was then accepted to make some changes to make it actually work.

The same thing is true in reverse of implementing standards in a browser, which is why IE is soooo huge, they've maintained their quirks mode, as well as an enhanced more compliant mode... I think that moving towards compliance is important.. but bear in mind, even most government websites that have standards compliance regulations don't comply with them... Once this improves, so will other things...

It's part of dealing with a huge fluid system... it makes fidonet look like a fascist dictatorshipt..

--
Michael J. Ryan - tracker1(at)theroughnecks(dot)net - www.theroughnecks.net icq: 4935386 - AIM/AOL: azTracker1 - Y!: azTracker1 - MSN/Win: (email)

... FRA #059: Free advice is seldom cheap.

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