paulie420 wrote to Ogg <=-
Re: Re: Nice BBS/SyncTerm article in Raspberry Pi Tips, Tricks &
Fixes
By: Ogg to All on Mon May 18 2020 05:06 pm
Hello Paulie420!
** On Thursday 14.05.20 - 00:04, paulie420 wrote to DaiTengu:
I think the reference to digital privacy is more about keeping said
information out of the hands of those large corporations and less
about some random sysop having the access. In that respect, BBSes do
offer a form of privacy that is extinct in the current internet age.
The public is just blindly carrying on and giving places like FB all our information for nothing but it should be for $omething.
What I'd prefer, as an alternative, is paying $10/mo for a totally
ad-free track-free everything-free Facebook. Just let me pay, because
the service, content and amount of people on it are valuable, for the service that I use.
And leave me out of all the algorithmn bullshit.
Ogg wrote to paulie420 <=-
Hello paulie420!
** On Monday 18.05.20 - 21:13, paulie420 wrote to Ogg:
The public is just blindly carrying on and giving places like FB all
our information for nothing but it should be for $omething.
What I'd prefer, as an alternative, is paying $10/mo for a totally ad- free track-free everything-free Facebook. Just let me pay, because the service, content and amount of people on it are valuable, for the
service that I use.
Even $1/mo is too much! It is OUR data that they are using. The
cashflow should come in OUR direction.
I made one more LAST visit to FB tonight. I'm not going back there for
at least a month.
In this last visit alone, my data meter indicated that it took 1.8MB (received) and 500K (sent) just to load all the crap before everything settled down. FB is a very big pig.
paulie420 wrote to Ogg <=-
Re: Re: Nice BBS/SyncTerm article in Raspberry Pi Tips, Tricks & Fixes
By: Ogg to All on Mon May 18 2020 05:06 pm
Hello Paulie420!
** On Thursday 14.05.20 - 00:04, paulie420 wrote to DaiTengu:
I think the reference to digital privacy is more about keeping said
information out of the hands of those large corporations and less
about some random sysop having the access. In that respect, BBSes do
offer a form of privacy that is extinct in the current internet age.
The public is just blindly carrying on and giving places like FB all ou information for nothing but it should be for $omething.
What I'd prefer, as an alternative, is paying $10/mo for a totally ad-free track-free everything-free Facebook. Just let me pay, because the service, content and amount of people on it are valuable, for the service that I use.
And leave me out of all the algorithmn bullshit.
I would bet a five-dollar-footlong that they make more than $10/month per us A friend of mine is a market expert and we discussed it one night over dinne I asked him if they likely studied the cost/month for a user for this experience and the outcome was above what people would pay. He agreed that h had heard from contacts within the company that they entertained the idea bu their marketing team discovered that, to stay profitable per unit of sale, t cost would be prohibitive for the standard user. The development cost, alone to partition users from the facebook treatment would be expensive. Those use would need to log into a separate facebook since all the algorighms are deep ensconced in the site's code.
I quit facebook in 2009 after they socially engineered me in a very scammy w and I never looked back.
Daniel Traechin
... Visit me at gopher://gcpp.world
Ogg wrote to paulie420 <=-
Hello paulie420!
** On Monday 18.05.20 - 21:13, paulie420 wrote to Ogg:
The public is just blindly carrying on and giving places like FB all
our information for nothing but it should be for $omething.
What I'd prefer, as an alternative, is paying $10/mo for a totally ad- free track-free everything-free Facebook. Just let me pay, because the service, content and amount of people on it are valuable, for the service that I use.
Even $1/mo is too much! It is OUR data that they are using. The cashflow should come in OUR direction.
I would normally agree. If they're going to profit off your data they shoudl pay you. But you are using their 'service' for free so yuo're paying for it with your privacy. All of it. The scope of spying they do would make you sleepless.
I made one more LAST visit to FB tonight. I'm not going back there for at least a month.
In this last visit alone, my data meter indicated that it took 1.8MB (received) and 500K (sent) just to load all the crap before everything settled down. FB is a very big pig.
Much of that is analytics and trackers sitting on your cache. Their intrusiveness is astonishing.
Daniel Traechin
... Visit me at gopher://gcpp.world
I would bet a five-dollar-footlong that they make more than $10/month per user. A friend of mine is a market expert and we discussed it one night over dinner. I asked him if they likely studied the cost/month for a user for this experience and the outcome was above what people would pay. He agreed that he had heard from contacts within the company that they entertained the idea but their marketing team discovered that, to stay profitable per unit of sale, the cost would be prohibitive for the standard user. The development cost, alone, to partition users from the facebook treatment would be expensive. Those users would need to log into a separate facebook since all the algorighms are deeply ensconced in the site's code.
I quit facebook in 2009 after they socially engineered me in a very scammy way and I never looked back.
Daniel Traechin
Re: Re: Nice BBS/SyncTerm art
By: calcmandan to Ogg on Tue May 19 2020 05:44 am
After I started running a Pi-hole with some added lists I noticed in between 25 and 50% requests blocked on cetain sites. Some news sites would not launch at all unless Pi-hole was throttled back.Ogg wrote to paulie420 <=-
Recently I 've been hearing about smart TV's and IP security cameras being quite "chatty" with more than just their manufacturer's sites.
Moondog wrote to calcmandan <=-
Years ago I read where email spammers were making a good living with 3%
of recipients responding to their ads. This is just with random cold calling. I can see where advertising tailored by studying a user's
social media could bring in way more revenue.
Moondog wrote to calcmandan <=-
Re: Re: Nice BBS/SyncTerm art
By: calcmandan to Ogg on Tue May 19 2020 05:44 am
Ogg wrote to paulie420 <=-
Hello paulie420!
** On Monday 18.05.20 - 21:13, paulie420 wrote to Ogg:
The public is just blindly carrying on and giving places like FB all
our information for nothing but it should be for $omething.
What I'd prefer, as an alternative, is paying $10/mo for a totally ad- free track-free everything-free Facebook. Just let me pay, because the service, content and amount of people on it are valuable, for the service that I use.
Even $1/mo is too much! It is OUR data that they are using. The cashflow should come in OUR direction.
I would normally agree. If they're going to profit off your data they shoudl pay you. But you are using their 'service' for free so yuo're paying for it with your privacy. All of it. The scope of spying they do would make you sleepless.
I made one more LAST visit to FB tonight. I'm not going back there for at least a month.
In this last visit alone, my data meter indicated that it took 1.8MB (received) and 500K (sent) just to load all the crap before everything settled down. FB is a very big pig.
Much of that is analytics and trackers sitting on your cache. Their intrusiveness is astonishing.
Daniel Traechin
... Visit me at gopher://gcpp.world
After I started running a Pi-hole with some added lists I noticed in between 25 and 50% requests blocked on cetain sites. Some news sites would not launch at all unless Pi-hole was throttled back.
Recently I 've been hearing about smart TV's and IP security cameras
being quite "chatty" with more than just their manufacturer's sites.
On 05-20-20 04:51, calcmandan wrote to Moondog <=-
I manage my agency's proxies and yes. They're being really creative
with ways to force ads on users. My job is to provide them a sense of privacy as well as a non-distracting browsing experience.
big time. My bro has IPcameras and he opened a hole on his firewall overnight to let the cameras update their firmware and they chatted
about 2gigs overnight.
i'm like...
I really hate what the web has turned into.
"We cannot have a society in which, if two people wish to communicate, the only way that can happen is if it's financed by a third person who wishes
to manipulate them" - Jaron Lanier.
Kurisu wrote to calcmandan <=-
Re: Re: Nice BBS/SyncTerm art
By: calcmandan to Moondog on Wed May 20 2020 12:32 am
I really hate what the web has turned into.
I feel the exact same way.
In a short rant, it's become an overly-centralized data harvesting
mess. The sheer volume of data mining being done is bad enough, but
when you add in that people, for the most part, only visit the same few websites over and over (Facebook, YouTube, and other Google services proper) all the power and value of the web has gone to the control of
just a few groups. It was never intended to be that way, yet that's
what happened. I could go on about that, but the fact that it's become
so centralized I think bugs me the most. The data mining wouldn't be nearly as bad if everyone didn't use these same few sites and, even
moreso IMO, embrace a company (Google) which literally, and openly,
makes its money from data.
They complain about privacy online, yet see no problem pouring their digital lives into a Google database willingly, all because of "convenience."
Sorry, I just really needed to rant, as what you typed rang so true
with me and how I feel about the subject on a whole.
Even $1/mo is too much! It is OUR data that they are using. The
cashflow should come in OUR direction.
Jaron Lanier has a book called "You are not a Gadget" that describes a micropayment system where art and content creators can be paid
directly for their work. It's a utopian vision of how the internet
could be, and how it could directly benefit the people that create the content that now only benefit the investors.
He's pretty outspoken about the state of the tech, and has an
interesting Ted talk called something like "Why you need to quit
social media".
They complain about privacy online, yet see no problem pouring their digital lives into a Google database willingly, all because of "convenience."
Sorry, I just really needed to rant, as what you typed rang so true
with me and how I feel about the subject on a whole.
Add to that the proliferation of 'bait' sites, which are really just mass produced 'information', designed to capture a spot in google search, so that it
will be clicked on and ad revenue generated. Quite often, I may search for an
answer to a question, and get links to some site, where the web page linked to
has the briefest non answer, and heaps of ads, lists, etc. Do we need the crap
blog post with two sentences to say that SSH can be used to access a system securely?
Add to that the proliferation of 'bait' sites, which are really just mass produced 'information', designed to capture a spot in google search, so that it
will be clicked on and ad revenue generated. Quite often, I may search for an
answer to a question, and get links to some site, where the web page linked to
has the briefest non answer, and heaps of ads, lists, etc. Do we need the crap
blog post with two sentences to say that SSH can be used to access a system securely?
The bait sites are such a data hog. It takes a long time for all the content to
load and usually they arrange it so that the ads load first.
At first they look interesting. Who wouldn't want to briefly check out a story on the top highly rated films and their "easter eggs", for example. But each page is just a few sentences with a filler image, and big NEXT / PREVIOUS buttons. The rest of the page is loaded with ads; the flashing or animated ones
are really annoying to me.
If you were to take the salient content of each page, you could probably read the relevant story very fast in one page-view.
Instead, these sites assume you have unlimited time and data to waste.
At first they look interesting. Who wouldn't want to briefly check
out a story on the top highly rated films and their "easter eggs",
for example. But each page is just a few sentences with a filler
image, and big NEXT / PREVIOUS buttons. The rest of the page is
loaded with ads; the flashing or animated ones are really annoying
to me.
This was bound to happen, with many users expecting to use the Internet with understanding what it is and how it works. People have a mental model of computers, where it is an closed box appliance, rather than a tool. This le to a belief that these companies provide a service, when in reality, the service they are providing is just taking control of something which the use could have engineered themselves. All to often, I see people subscribe the services of an app/cloud service provider, to do something which could have been done by e-mail, or email and a basic web page.
Kurisu wrote to Dennisk <=-
Re: Re: Nice BBS/SyncTerm art
By: Dennisk to Kurisu on Thu May 21 2020 10:18 am
This was bound to happen, with many users expecting to use the Internet with understanding what it is and how it works. People have a mental model of computers, where it is an closed box appliance, rather than a tool. This le to a belief that these companies provide a service, when in reality, the service they are providing is just taking control of something which the use could have engineered themselves. All to often, I see people subscribe the services of an app/cloud service provider, to do something which could have been done by e-mail, or email and a basic web page.
You really were spot on with this. People, on a whole, just don't understand what a computer, in any form, really is from a perspective
of captability. Then again I am one of those people who thinks one
should understand things as much as they can which, while yes, it's not necessary to use and enjoy something, does allow a person to get
maximum usage out of the machine, tool, what have you.
User ignorance, the nature of relying on SEO or freaking YouTube videos
to determine what information a person wil find (see the click bait comment you made as a fine example of SEO being abused for
pointlessness) and corporate greed and forcing things all into the same basket (I'm looking at you Google) has just really messed up not only
the internet but user perception on what the internet actually is, how
it can and should be used, and how it can better ones life.
It's sad, really.
...The rest of the page is
loaded with ads; the flashing or animated ones are really annoying
to me.
sounds like you're not using a decent/proper ad filter... i rarely see
any ads in my browsing... i'm using firefox with adblock and
noscript... when i was using facecrook, no ads... i use twitter all
the time, no ads... those click-bait articles you mention above, no
ads... amazon, no ads... sure, it took me a little while to get
noscript set so that only the stuff needed for a site to work was
loaded but once that was done, no ads...
Kurisu wrote to Dennisk <=-
Re: Re: Nice BBS/SyncTerm art
By: Dennisk to Kurisu on Thu May 21 2020 10:18 am
This was bound to happen, with many users expecting to use the Internet w understanding what it is and how it works. People have a mental model of computers, where it is an closed box appliance, rather than a tool. This to a belief that these companies provide a service, when in reality, the service they are providing is just taking control of something which the could have engineered themselves. All to often, I see people subscribe t services of an app/cloud service provider, to do something which could ha been done by e-mail, or email and a basic web page.
You really were spot on with this. People, on a whole, just don't understand what a computer, in any form, really is from a perspective of captability. Then again I am one of those people who thinks one should understand things as much as they can which, while yes, it's not necessary to use and enjoy something, does allow a person to get maximum usage out of the machine, tool, what have you.
User ignorance, the nature of relying on SEO or freaking YouTube videos to determine what information a person wil find (see the click bait comment you made as a fine example of SEO being abused for pointlessness) and corporate greed and forcing things all into the same basket (I'm looking at you Google) has just really messed up not only the internet but user perception on what the internet actually is, how it can and should be used, and how it can better ones life.
It's sad, really.
I work for a large organisation, and their management of information is mind bogglingly crap. We are literally paying people well above minimum wage, to copy and paste information from one document to another, then sometimes, to copy from THAT to another still. Then paying for someone to eyeball the document to make sure the information matches. Huh? Are people aware that computer can duplicate information flawlessly? Are people aware that you ca store data in such a way that you can write queries to extract the data you need? That the computer itself can take that data and put it into a formatt document for printing? That a computer itself can take care of business log such as when one data set becomes active or inactive? It seems no. They co do so much more with a simple CSV file and some python scripts.
It's like watching someone with a car, have it pulled by a horse and use it some kind of carriage, then complaining that the horses are getting worn dow and getting MORE horses! All because they don't know what a car can actuall do, and people seem to think it is better to just throw more resources at a problem, than make people learn something new.
Because managers have no idea what computers actually do, that you can actua write new logic and instructions, they either go with the crap status quo, o purchase goliath 'consumer web based' enterprise software with poor interoperability with anything but MS Office. They only think in terms of 'apps', and the 'documents' those apps open and close.
All this I think came from the expectation that users should just be able to use appplications, which is wrong headed. They are NOT using applications, they are processing data using logic and storage technology. It's a seeming subtle difference of view, but it leads to vastly different results.
... He does the work of 3 Men...Moe, Larry & Curly
Right. I don't have any blockers installed, anymore. I just have "Disconnect for Facebook" which claims to disable 3rd party websites from accessing my Facebook.
I did use noscript for a little while. Instead of adblock, I used uBlock. Again.. newer versions just stopped working with my current XP + FF 52.8
i use noadhosts now with a popup blocker/prompter i have other
adblockers installed but they didnt really catch everything.
for facebook i use facebook purity addon. that's decent.
Moondog wrote to Dennisk <=-
Re: Re: Nice BBS/SyncTerm art
By: Dennisk to Kurisu on Sat May 23 2020 10:49 am
Kurisu wrote to Dennisk <=-
Re: Re: Nice BBS/SyncTerm art
By: Dennisk to Kurisu on Thu May 21 2020 10:18 am
This was bound to happen, with many users expecting to use the Internet w understanding what it is and how it works. People have a mental model of computers, where it is an closed box appliance, rather than a tool. This to a belief that these companies provide a service, when in reality, the service they are providing is just taking control of something which the could have engineered themselves. All to often, I see people subscribe t services of an app/cloud service provider, to do something which could ha been done by e-mail, or email and a basic web page.
You really were spot on with this. People, on a whole, just don't understand what a computer, in any form, really is from a perspective of captability. Then again I am one of those people who thinks one should understand things as much as they can which, while yes, it's not necessary to use and enjoy something, does allow a person to get maximum usage out of the machine, tool, what have you.
User ignorance, the nature of relying on SEO or freaking YouTube videos to determine what information a person wil find (see the click bait comment you made as a fine example of SEO being abused for pointlessness) and corporate greed and forcing things all into the same basket (I'm looking at you Google) has just really messed up not only the internet but user perception on what the internet actually is, how it can and should be used, and how it can better ones life.
It's sad, really.
I work for a large organisation, and their management of information is mind bogglingly crap. We are literally paying people well above minimum wage, to copy and paste information from one document to another, then sometimes, to copy from THAT to another still. Then paying for someone to eyeball the document to make sure the information matches. Huh? Are people aware that computer can duplicate information flawlessly? Are people aware that you ca store data in such a way that you can write queries to extract the data you need? That the computer itself can take that data and put it into a formatt document for printing? That a computer itself can take care of business log such as when one data set becomes active or inactive? It seems no. They co do so much more with a simple CSV file and some python scripts.
It's like watching someone with a car, have it pulled by a horse and use it some kind of carriage, then complaining that the horses are getting worn dow and getting MORE horses! All because they don't know what a car can actuall do, and people seem to think it is better to just throw more resources at a problem, than make people learn something new.
Because managers have no idea what computers actually do, that you can actua write new logic and instructions, they either go with the crap status quo, o purchase goliath 'consumer web based' enterprise software with poor interoperability with anything but MS Office. They only think in terms of 'apps', and the 'documents' those apps open and close.
All this I think came from the expectation that users should just be able to use appplications, which is wrong headed. They are NOT using applications, they are processing data using logic and storage technology. It's a seeming subtle difference of view, but it leads to vastly different results.
... He does the work of 3 Men...Moe, Larry & Curly
Several years ago i applied for unemployment, and part of the process
was to go to an agency that helped find jobs. They had this cool
online program that aksed questions about where you worked and when,
and what you did, then assembled it into a functional resume. For
users who worked in jobs that normally do not require a resume, I can
see how that would be a time saver. I also could bet whatever format
they used could be easily stripped down and digested by HR software.
| Sysop: | MCMLXXIX |
|---|---|
| Location: | Prospect, CT |
| Users: | 325 |
| Nodes: | 10 (0 / 10) |
| Uptime: | 28:01:37 |
| Calls: | 508 |
| Messages: | 220003 |