• Linux Laptop Ideas?

    From Jagossel@VERT/FRUGALBB to All on Monday, June 04, 2018 20:53:23
    I've gotten out my old Lenovo laptop (the screen fell off, but still functioning otherwise) and installed Arch Linux on it with SSH. Now I can use my phone to remote into the laptop when I'm home and work on it.

    Awesome, but...

    I have no idea what to do with it and what to work on next. Here a couple of small projects that I have in mind:
    - xrdp server: allow remote GUI connections over RDP
    - virtual machine server w/ web access and RDP
    - node.js workstation

    These are not programming projects at all, just something to set up in what little free time I get at nights. I am open to other ideas as well.

    Thoughts?

    -jag
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Jagossel on Monday, June 04, 2018 20:21:08
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Jagossel to All on Mon Jun 04 2018 08:53 pm

    I've gotten out my old Lenovo laptop (the screen fell off, but still functioning otherwise) and installed Arch Linux on it with SSH. Now I can use my phone to remote into the laptop when I'm home and work on it.

    Awesome, but...

    I have no idea what to do with it and what to work on next. Here a couple of small projects that I have in mind:
    - xrdp server: allow remote GUI connections over RDP
    - virtual machine server w/ web access and RDP
    - node.js workstation

    These are not programming projects at all, just something to set up in what little free time I get at nights. I am open to other ideas as well.

    Thoughts?

    Maybe a web server? Streaming media server? Plex is a nice media server software and can be managed remotely via a web interface, and you can also add media to it by simply copying the files over to the machine via the network.

    Nightfox

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  • From Jagossel@VERT/FRUGALBB to Nightfox on Tuesday, June 05, 2018 06:42:11
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Nightfox to Jagossel on Mon Jun 04 2018 08:21 pm

    I've gotten out my old Lenovo laptop (the screen fell off, but still functioning otherwise) and installed Arch Linux on it with SSH. Now I c use my phone to remote into the laptop when I'm home and work on it.

    I have no idea what to do with it and what to work on next.

    Maybe a web server? Streaming media server? Plex is a nice media server software and can be managed remotely via a web interface, and you can also a media to it by simply copying the files over to the machine via the network.

    As far as a web server, I was thinking of having a web browser version of an IDE for the node.js workstation, something like Cloud9 (http://c9.io).

    I have forgotten about Plex Media Server. I've set it up in the past, but I thought that I've asked about the legality of using it to keep local copies of our movies and concluded it was illegal to do so. It might have been a discussion with the lunch crowd I hang out with. I do know that it can stream online content as well by transcoding it, still though...

    -jag
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Jagossel on Tuesday, June 05, 2018 09:12:34
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Jagossel to Nightfox on Tue Jun 05 2018 06:42 am

    I have forgotten about Plex Media Server. I've set it up in the past, but I thought that I've asked about the legality of using it to keep local copies of our movies and concluded it was illegal to do so. It might have been a discussion with the lunch crowd I hang out with. I do know that it can stream online content as well by transcoding it, still though...

    If you own a movie on DVD, Blu-ray, etc., it seems hard to argue that it would be illegal to do something like that with something you bought and own. I'm not sure it's worth fretting over whether you watch the movie by putting in the disc or watching it from your media server. It's similar with music too - People might have a lot of music on CDs, but these days hardly anyone carries around a CD player to listen to their music. People tend to rip their music to MP3 or other format and listen on their media player, smart phone, etc..

    Nightfox

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  • From Digital Man@VERT to Nightfox on Tuesday, June 05, 2018 12:23:44
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Nightfox to Jagossel on Mon Jun 04 2018 08:21 pm

    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Jagossel to All on Mon Jun 04 2018 08:53 pm

    I've gotten out my old Lenovo laptop (the screen fell off, but still functioning otherwise) and installed Arch Linux on it with SSH. Now I can use my phone to remote into the laptop when I'm home and work on it.

    Awesome, but...

    I have no idea what to do with it and what to work on next. Here a couple of small projects that I have in mind:
    - xrdp server: allow remote GUI connections over RDP
    - virtual machine server w/ web access and RDP
    - node.js workstation

    These are not programming projects at all, just something to set up in what little free time I get at nights. I am open to other ideas as well.

    Thoughts?

    Maybe a web server? Streaming media server? Plex is a nice media server software and can be managed remotely via a web interface, and you can also add media to it by simply copying the files over to the machine via the network.

    Plex plays a prominent role in my family's A/V entertainment. :-)

    digital man

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Digital Man on Tuesday, June 05, 2018 12:52:40
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Digital Man to Nightfox on Tue Jun 05 2018 12:23 pm

    Plex plays a prominent role in my family's A/V entertainment. :-)

    We have been using Plex quite a bit too. Sometimes though, we've noticed that when trying to play a video from Plex, it occasionally is unable to play and sits at the loading/buffering spinner. It happens even when we aren't heavily using our network. The other day I ended up just copying the movie onto a USB drive and plugging that into the TV to watch it.

    Nightfox

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  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Nightfox on Tuesday, June 05, 2018 21:12:08
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Nightfox to Jagossel on Tue Jun 05 2018 09:12:34

    If you own a movie on DVD, Blu-ray, etc., it seems hard to argue that it would be illegal to do something like that with something you bought and own. I'm not sure it's worth fretting over whether you watch the movie by

    It's not illegal to store a backup of the DVD. It's just illegal to circumvent DVD encryption to do so. Either way, they got you.

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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Nightfox on Tuesday, June 05, 2018 15:46:08
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Nightfox to Jagossel on Tue Jun 05 2018 09:12 am

    If you own a movie on DVD, Blu-ray, etc., it seems hard to argue that it would be illegal to do something like that with something you bought and own. I'm not sure it's worth fretting over whether you watch the movie by putting in the disc or watching it from your media server.

    The 1974 Copyright act includes fair use provisions, including play on
    other devices where you own the media and archival backups. It's the DMCA that makes it illegal to crack the copy protection in order to make your (legal) backup/media translation.

    It's why you could make a cassette copy of an LP album, since you don't have a turntable in your car.

    And, in case you didn't know, I'm not a lawyer.

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Tuesday, June 05, 2018 16:18:27
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Tue Jun 05 2018 09:12 pm

    It's not illegal to store a backup of the DVD. It's just illegal to circumvent DVD encryption to do so. Either way, they got you.

    That's an odd legal situation.. I suppose that's why some movies on DVD/blu-ray include a "digital copy" that you can download from them. I always thought "digital copy" was an odd name for that - The first time I saw a DVD saying "Includes digital copy", I thought of course it's digital, it's a DVD.. I didn't realize at first that "digital copy" referred to a file on your hard drive. I'd think they would have made a better name for that..

    Nightfox

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Tuesday, June 05, 2018 16:19:42
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Tue Jun 05 2018 09:12 pm

    It's not illegal to store a backup of the DVD. It's just illegal to circumvent DVD encryption to do so. Either way, they got you.

    Since music CDs don't use encryption, I suppose there's no legal problem with ripping your own CDs for your own personal use?

    Nightfox

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to poindexter FORTRAN on Tuesday, June 05, 2018 16:21:12
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Nightfox on Tue Jun 05 2018 03:46 pm

    The 1974 Copyright act includes fair use provisions, including play on other devices where you own the media and archival backups. It's the DMCA that makes it illegal to crack the copy protection in order to make your (legal) backup/media translation.

    It's why you could make a cassette copy of an LP album, since you don't have a turntable in your car.

    I'm wondering if it's legally okay to rip music CDs for your own use, since CDs don't use encryption.

    And as far as DVD/Blu-ray ripping, if you're just using someone else's software to rip a movie, technically I'd think it wasn't you who cracked the copy protection; it was someone else who did that..

    Nightfox

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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Jagossel on Tuesday, June 05, 2018 19:44:15
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Jagossel to Nightfox on Tue Jun 05 2018 06:42 am

    I have forgotten about Plex Media Server. I've set it up in the past, but I thought that I've asked about the legality of using it to keep local copies of our movies and concluded it was illegal to do so. It might have been a


    it's not illegal. you are allowed to have one backup.
    unless they changed that. and if they did, fuck 'em
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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Digital Man on Tuesday, June 05, 2018 19:48:29
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Digital Man to Nightfox on Tue Jun 05 2018 12:23 pm

    also add media to it by simply copying the files over to the machine via the network.

    Plex plays a prominent role in my family's A/V entertainment. :-)


    i was using it for a while but it was choking on large files being played over the network.

    instead i use a cheap walmart laptop and play my videos with vlc.
    the girlfriend likes a few tv shows so she has slingtv on it.
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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Nightfox on Tuesday, June 05, 2018 19:53:22
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Nightfox to Digital Man on Tue Jun 05 2018 12:52 pm

    that when trying to play a video from Plex, it occasionally is unable to play and sits at the loading/buffering spinner. It happens even when we aren't heavily using our network. The other day I ended up just copying the movie onto a USB drive and plugging that into the TV to watch it.


    try using kodi instead.
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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Nightfox on Tuesday, June 05, 2018 19:54:36
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Nightfox to Chai on Tue Jun 05 2018 04:19 pm

    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Tue Jun 05 2018 09:12 pm

    It's not illegal to store a backup of the DVD. It's just illegal to circumvent DVD encryption to do so. Either way, they got you.

    Since music CDs don't use encryption, I suppose there's no legal problem with ripping your own CDs for your own personal use?



    music cds have had copy protection for 18 years. i'm not sure if they bother to add it still because i dont buy cds
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  • From Jagossel@VERT/MTLGEEK to Nightfox on Tuesday, June 05, 2018 21:37:43
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Nightfox to Chai on Tue Jun 05 2018 16:18:27

    It's not illegal to store a backup of the DVD. It's just illegal to circumvent DVD encryption to do so. Either way, they got you.

    That's an odd legal situation.. I suppose that's why some movies on DVD/blu-ray include a "digital copy" that you can download from them. I alw thought "digital copy" was an odd name for that - The first time I saw a DVD saying "Includes digital copy", I thought of course it's digital, it's a DVD I didn't realize at first that "digital copy" referred to a file on your har drive. I'd think they would have made a better name for that..

    For a while there, we were getting movies from Disney every month, and we'd get a variety of formats: DVD, Blu-Ray, and "digital copy". The interesting thing about the "digital copy" is that they give you a code to get to your favorite stream provider to redeem that digital copy. Our family heavily streams for entertainment (TV shows, movies, and music). That, to me, would be the reason to NOT have Plex: we barely own hard copies of anything.

    We, also, have Pandora Premium and it's so worth the $10/month. I've downloaded a few albums and been listening to music in offline mode.

    -jag
    Code it, Script it, Automate it!

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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 06, 2018 09:35:00
    Nightfox wrote to Jagossel <=-

    If you own a movie on DVD, Blu-ray, etc., it seems hard to argue that
    it would be illegal to do something like that with something you bought and own. I'm not sure it's worth fretting over whether you watch the

    Depends where you are. In Australia, you are allowed to convert media formats for compatibility with your own playback devices, so if you copy one of your Blu-Ray discs to your Plex server and then use the Plex server to view it in your own home, you're legal (according to my understanding). Different jurisdictions have different laws, of course.

    The common example cited here is ripping a CD you own to MP3 for use on your portable media player.

    Among the crap that is a lot of copyright law, there is some common sense. :)


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Chai on Wednesday, June 06, 2018 09:36:00
    Chai wrote to Nightfox <=-

    It's not illegal to store a backup of the DVD. It's just illegal to circumvent DVD encryption to do so. Either way, they got you.

    But for making it compatible with another playback device you own? Hmm, there's a lawyers picnic waiting to happen! :D


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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to MRO on Tuesday, June 05, 2018 20:12:58
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: MRO to Nightfox on Tue Jun 05 2018 07:54 pm

    Since music CDs don't use encryption, I suppose there's no legal
    problem with ripping your own CDs for your own personal use?

    music cds have had copy protection for 18 years. i'm not sure if they bother to add it still because i dont buy cds

    I've been collecting music CDs since 1992 and ripping them in PCs since the late 90s, and I've never had a CD with copy protection. I've always been able to rip CDs easily.

    I do remember hearing Sony releasing some music CDs with some kind of copy protection and there being a lot of controversy about it around 2006 or so because (from what I heard) Sony was putting rootkits on their music CDs that ended up crippling some Windows computers. I never had that happen to me though (I don't think I've bought a Sony music CD), but other than that, generally music CDs have not had copy protection that I know of. Copy protection would have to be part of the standard, and players would have to support the encryption in order to play it. Since that was not part of the original audio CD spec, copy protection in audio CDs has never been common, to my knowlege.

    Nightfox

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Jagossel on Tuesday, June 05, 2018 20:16:08
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Jagossel to Nightfox on Tue Jun 05 2018 09:37 pm

    For a while there, we were getting movies from Disney every month, and we'd get a variety of formats: DVD, Blu-Ray, and "digital copy". The interesting thing about the "digital copy" is that they give you a code to get to your favorite stream provider to redeem that digital copy. Our family heavily streams for entertainment (TV shows, movies, and music). That, to me, would be the reason to NOT have Plex: we barely own hard copies of anything.

    Seems to me that would be a reason FOR having Plex.. If you redeem a lot of digital copy movies to download, you could put them on your Plex server to watch. Unless I've misunderstood.. I've never used a redemption code for a digital copy - Does it allow you to download a video file of the movie, or does it allow unlimited streaming from somewhere?

    We, also, have Pandora Premium and it's so worth the $10/month. I've downloaded a few albums and been listening to music in offline mode.

    I didn't know Pandora lets you download albums.. I've used Pandora (free version) a little bit, but what has annoyed me a little about Pandora is that you'll ask it to play a certain band's music, and it will, but then it will start playing other band's music that sounds similar. I suppose that's part of the point of Pandora, but usually if I ask for a certain band, I would just want it to play that band.

    Nightfox

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Vk3jed on Tuesday, June 05, 2018 20:17:00
    Re: Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Wed Jun 06 2018 09:35 am

    Depends where you are. In Australia, you are allowed to convert media formats for compatibility with your own playback devices, so if you copy one of your Blu-Ray discs to your Plex server and then use the Plex server to view it in your own home, you're legal (according to my understanding). Different jurisdictions have different laws, of course.

    Is that true even for encrypted discs? Normally, DVD and blu-ray discs have encryption to try to prevent people from ripping them.

    Nightfox

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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Nightfox on Tuesday, June 05, 2018 23:06:04
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Nightfox to MRO on Tue Jun 05 2018 08:12 pm

    I've been collecting music CDs since 1992 and ripping them in PCs since the late 90s, and I've never had a CD with copy protection. I've always been able to rip CDs easily.


    what software do you use?

    i know personally there are eminem cds with this protection.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Compact_Disc_and_DVD_copy_protection_sche mes



    i think your problem is you are using yourself as a reference when you arent an authority.

    you may have no experience with something, but that doesnt mean this something doesnt exist. you just are limited in what you did.
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  • From Digital Man@VERT to Nightfox on Tuesday, June 05, 2018 23:05:54
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Nightfox to Digital Man on Tue Jun 05 2018 12:52 pm

    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Digital Man to Nightfox on Tue Jun 05 2018 12:23 pm

    Plex plays a prominent role in my family's A/V entertainment. :-)

    We have been using Plex quite a bit too. Sometimes though, we've noticed that when trying to play a video from Plex, it occasionally is unable to play and sits at the loading/buffering spinner. It happens even when we aren't heavily using our network. The other day I ended up just copying the movie onto a USB drive and plugging that into the TV to watch it.

    When we have problems with Plex, often it's the player (not the server) and using a differnet player/device (e.g. PC/browser vs. Xbox vs. tablet vs. phone vs. Roku vs. FireTV, etc.) or updating the player on the device fixes the problem.

    digital man

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  • From Jagossel@VERT/MTLGEEK to MRO on Wednesday, June 06, 2018 06:24:19
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: MRO to Nightfox on Tue Jun 05 2018 19:54:36

    music cds have had copy protection for 18 years. i'm not sure if they bother add it still because i dont buy cds

    Sheesh... Remember when Sony put in a eoot kit on their CDs to prevent copying it?

    -jag
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  • From Jagossel@VERT/MTLGEEK to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 06, 2018 06:40:16
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Nightfox to Jagossel on Tue Jun 05 2018 20:16:08

    For a while there, we were getting movies from Disney every month, and we'd get a variety of formats: DVD, Blu-Ray, and "digital copy". The interesting thing about the "digital copy" is that they give you a code get to your favorite stream provider to redeem that digital copy. Our family heavily streams for entertainment (TV shows, movies, and music). That, to me, would be the reason to NOT have Plex: we barely own hard copies of anything.

    Seems to me that would be a reason FOR having Plex.. If you redeem a lot of digital copy movies to download, you could put them on your Plex server to watch. Unless I've misunderstood.. I've never used a redemption code for a digital copy - Does it allow you to download a video file of the movie, or d it allow unlimited streaming from somewhere?

    I haven't check to see if it was possible to download the movies; I've assumed that the streaming services wouldn't let you. You can get unlimited streaming, though. With a couple of these movies from Disney, I'm sure we've gotten our money's worth if we rented the movie.

    We, also, have Pandora Premium and it's so worth the $10/month. I've downloaded a few albums and been listening to music in offline mode.

    I didn't know Pandora lets you download albums.. I've used Pandora (free version) a little bit, but what has annoyed me a little about Pandora is tha you'll ask it to play a certain band's music, and it will, but then it will start playing other band's music that sounds similar. I suppose that's part the point of Pandora, but usually if I ask for a certain band, I would just want it to play that band.

    IIRC, it was some licensing thing that kept you from getting the song or album directly playing on request; eventually it will get there. Yes, the point was to get you to discover other similar artists. It worked well for me because I never heard of Loscil, E.S. Posthumus, H.U.V.A Networks, ATB, OceanLab, etc. before I sarted listening to Pandora back in 2007. Still love listening to Pandora.

    -jag
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to MRO on Wednesday, June 06, 2018 08:49:01
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: MRO to Nightfox on Tue Jun 05 2018 11:06 pm

    I've been collecting music CDs since 1992 and ripping them in PCs
    since the late 90s, and I've never had a CD with copy protection.
    I've always been able to rip CDs easily.

    what software do you use?

    Usually I use CDex for ripping CDs:
    https://cdex.mu
    I found CDex a long time ago, and its home page seems to have changed.
    I'm pretty sure iTunes can rip CDs too. And there are others.

    Nightfox

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Digital Man on Wednesday, June 06, 2018 08:56:11
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Digital Man to Nightfox on Tue Jun 05 2018 11:05 pm

    When we have problems with Plex, often it's the player (not the server) and using a differnet player/device (e.g. PC/browser vs. Xbox vs. tablet vs. phone vs. Roku vs. FireTV, etc.) or updating the player on the device fixes the problem.

    I've wondered if that could be it. I have updated the Plex server software on my server PC. I'll have to see if there is an updated Plex client on our TV (a Samsung smart TV), though last I checked, I don't think there had been an update to the Plex client software for the TV for a while.

    One problem area I've always had with Plex is viewing photos - The Plex client on our TV in the living room has often frozen when trying to view photos with Plex. Our TV upstairs (a different Samsung smart TV) hasn't had that issue with Plex though.

    Nightfox

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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Jagossel on Wednesday, June 06, 2018 09:49:37
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Jagossel to Nightfox on Wed Jun 06 2018 06:40 am

    IIRC, it was some licensing thing that kept you from getting the song or album directly playing on request; eventually it will get there. Yes, the point was to get you to discover other similar artists. It worked well for me because I never heard of Loscil, E.S. Posthumus, H.U.V.A Networks, ATB, OceanLab, etc. before I sarted listening to Pandora back in 2007.

    yeah, it was something about how many times you play a requested artist per hour that changes it from an broadcast service to an on-demand service.

    I knew a lot of people at Pandora. I worked at a startup that got bought by their (much bigger) competition back in 2007, and a lot of people not wanting to work for a big company ended up at Pandora and RocketLawyer.

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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Thursday, June 07, 2018 08:15:00
    Nightfox wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    Is that true even for encrypted discs? Normally, DVD and blu-ray discs have encryption to try to prevent people from ripping them.

    That is a good question, I'd have to have a re-read of the legislation. :)


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Thursday, June 07, 2018 09:20:00
    Nightfox wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-te copy of an LP album, since you
    don't
    have a turntable in your car.

    I'm wondering if it's legally okay to rip music CDs for your own use, since CDs don't use encryption.

    Again, depends on jurisdiction. I'm pretty confident that's legal here under the rules that allow media conversion. Of course, the unstated assumption is you own the CDs in question, copying someone else's CD is illegal.

    And as far as DVD/Blu-ray ripping, if you're just using someone else's software to rip a movie, technically I'd think it wasn't you who
    cracked the copy protection; it was someone else who did that..

    Hmm, I very much doubt that argument would stand up in court. (IANAL, of course).


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to MRO on Thursday, June 07, 2018 09:21:00
    MRO wrote to Digital Man <=-

    instead i use a cheap walmart laptop and play my videos with vlc.
    the girlfriend likes a few tv shows so she has slingtv on it.

    We use a desktop (connected to the TV via HDMI) for playing media files, YouTube, etc.


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to MRO on Thursday, June 07, 2018 09:23:00
    MRO wrote to Nightfox <=-

    music cds have had copy protection for 18 years. i'm not sure if they bother to add it still because i dont buy cds

    There were some attempts, but I'm not aware of any that stuck. The copy protection was either ineffective, interfered with legitimate playback, or used overly invasive methods (i.e. the infamous Sony "rootkit" incident).


    ... Each experiment, success or failure, is a learning experience.
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  • From Ed Vance@VERT/CAPCITY2 to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 06, 2018 15:22:00
    06-05-18 20:12 Nightfox wrote to MRO about Linux Laptop Ideas?
    Howdy Nightfox,

    @VIA: VERT/DIGDIST
    @MSGID: <5B17513A.35562.dove_dove-gen@digitaldistortionbbs.com>
    @REPLY: <5B1730CC.5137.dove-gen@bbses.info>
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: MRO to Nightfox on Tue Jun 05 2018 07:54 pm

    Since music CDs don't use encryption, I suppose there's no legal
    problem with ripping your own CDs for your own personal use?

    music cds have had copy protection for 18 years. i'm not sure if they bother to add it still because i dont buy cds

    I've been collecting music CDs since 1992 and ripping them in PCs since the late 90s, and I've never had a CD with copy protection. I've
    always been able to rip CDs easily.

    I do remember hearing Sony releasing some music CDs with some kind of
    copy protection and there being a lot of controversy about it around
    2006 or so because (from what I heard) Sony was putting rootkits on
    their music CDs that ended up crippling some Windows computers. I
    never had that happen to me though (I don't think I've bought a Sony
    music CD), but other than that, generally music CDs have not had copy protection that I know of. Copy protection would have to be part of
    the standard, and players would have to support the encryption in order
    to play it. Since that was not part of the original audio CD spec,
    copy protection in audio CDs has never been common, to my knowlege.

    VCR's had been in the Stores for a very long time before I bought one.

    My first VCR began to have problems playing or recording tapes so I bought another VCR to use.

    A friend only needed the Television Tuner portion of the VCR to use for
    a project, so I gave it to him.

    I wish I still had that old VCR now because Sony had Manufacturers of newer VCR's have to include 'their' DCMR 'protection circuitry' in all later VCR's.

    I learned about DCMR and what it does one day after I owned Two VCR's and had the A/V Output of one of them connected to the A/V Input of the second unit.

    We had just bought a VCR Movie at the Department Store and put the Cassette
    in the "Number One VCR" and when we tried to play it the image was scrambled
    up and we thought to take it back to the Store and get another copy that worked.

    Then I thought to put the VCR Tape in the Second VCR and saw the Movie play
    as clear as any other tape we had watched.

    Then I thought, "it must be the DCMR circuitry in the First VCR that messed
    up what was on the VCR Tape we wanted to watch" and it made me wish I still
    had that Older VCR I gave to my Friend because it just had regular Television and Video circuitry that Couldn't/Wouldn't had messed up the video image if
    we had put the "Protected" VCR Tape in it, to watch the Movie without expecting/experiencing any problems.

    T H A N K ' S S O N Y ! !

    Sony's products are the last thing I would think to purchase anymore since
    they started their DCMR fiasco.


    ... Why exercise? I already HAVE a well ROUNDED physique.
    --- MultiMail/MS-DOS v0.49
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  • From Jagossel@VERT/MTLGEEK to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 06, 2018 22:13:43
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Nightfox to MRO on Wed Jun 06 2018 08:49:01

    I'm pretty sure iTunes can rip CDs too. And there are others.

    I'm pretty sure that iTunes does rip CDs; I've useed that feature a few years ago when I had an iPod.

    Random thought: anyone remember MusicMatch?

    -jag
    Code it, Script it, Automate it!

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ MtlGeek - Geeks in Montreal - http://mtlgeek.com/ -
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Jagossel on Wednesday, June 06, 2018 21:42:42
    Re: Copyright Laws
    By: Jagossel to MRO on Wed Jun 06 2018 06:24 am

    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: MRO to Nightfox on Tue Jun 05 2018 19:54:36

    music cds have had copy protection for 18 years. i'm not sure if they bother add it still because i dont buy cds

    Sheesh... Remember when Sony put in a eoot kit on their CDs to prevent copying it?


    oh yeah, that was one of the most fucked up things. i was going to say that reps at sony consider even fair use piracy. they say that things are so cheap you can just buy another dvd instead of backing up
    ---
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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Vk3jed on Wednesday, June 06, 2018 21:53:20
    Re: Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Vk3jed to MRO on Thu Jun 07 2018 09:21 am

    MRO wrote to Digital Man <=-

    instead i use a cheap walmart laptop and play my videos with vlc.
    the girlfriend likes a few tv shows so she has slingtv on it.

    We use a desktop (connected to the TV via HDMI) for playing media files, YouTube, etc.



    after trying everything including a wdtv and an android box, just using a computer with hdmi is the best i've found.
    ---
    þ Synchronet þ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Vk3jed on Wednesday, June 06, 2018 21:54:00
    Re: Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Vk3jed to MRO on Thu Jun 07 2018 09:23 am

    MRO wrote to Nightfox <=-

    music cds have had copy protection for 18 years. i'm not sure if they bother to add it still because i dont buy cds

    There were some attempts, but I'm not aware of any that stuck. The copy protection was either ineffective, interfered with legitimate playback, or used overly invasive methods (i.e. the infamous Sony "rootkit" incident).



    there's some that worked at that time or required a ripper that had the ability around it.
    ---
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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Jagossel on Wednesday, June 06, 2018 22:14:01
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Jagossel to Nightfox on Wed Jun 06 2018 10:13 pm

    Random thought: anyone remember MusicMatch?

    yeah i used musicmatch jukebox.
    it was a good program for a while.
    ---
    þ Synchronet þ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Nightfox on Thursday, June 07, 2018 04:21:39
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Nightfox to Chai on Tue Jun 05 2018 16:19:42

    Since music CDs don't use encryption, I suppose there's no legal problem with ripping your own CDs for your own personal use?

    That's correct. As long as you don't distribute/upload the music file, ripping CD's is perfectly legal. At least, that is my understanding.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Amiga City - The BBS for the Amiga - more than 2,500+ files
  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Vk3jed on Thursday, June 07, 2018 04:41:21
    Re: Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Vk3jed to Chai on Wed Jun 06 2018 09:36:00

    It's not illegal to store a backup of the DVD. It's just illegal to circumvent DVD encryption to do so. Either way, they got you.

    But for making it compatible with another playback device you own? Hmm, there's a lawyers picnic waiting to happen! :D

    Well, I'm quoting American law. And presumably, I haven't researched copyright law in some time, so my info may be dated. But, yes, breaking any encryption meant to apply copy protection for copyrighted material is illegal (in the US). I believe, however, it falls under civil law. They would have to sue you, unless you upload it to a file sharing service or something contributing to sufficient damages. I remember the stories of 13 year olds being hit with outrageous fines due to record companies filing suits over file sharing mp3's. That hasn't happened in awhile (to my knowledge), but music is so cheap anyway. It's better just to buy or subscribe. Less risk of getting malware that way, and it is the right thing to do. IMHO.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Amiga City - The BBS for the Amiga - more than 2,500+ files
  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Nightfox on Thursday, June 07, 2018 04:56:13
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Nightfox to MRO on Tue Jun 05 2018 20:12:58

    I've been collecting music CDs since 1992 and ripping them in PCs since the late 90s, and I've never had a CD with copy protection. I've always been able to rip CDs easily.

    I do remember hearing Sony releasing some music CDs with some kind of copy protection and there being a lot of controversy about it around 2006 or so because (from what I heard) Sony was putting rootkits on their music CDs that ended up crippling some Windows computers. I never had that happen to me though (I don't think I've bought a Sony music CD), but other than that, generally music CDs have not had copy protection that I know of. Copy protection would have to be part of the standard, and players would have to support the encryption in order to play it. Since that was not part of the original audio CD spec, copy protection in audio CDs has never been common, to my knowlege.

    Well, there is copy protection on CD's (sorta), but I think it's just a bit that says the content is copy protected. It's up to the player/software to implement it. There is no actual copy protection mechanism, persay, (doing so would break backwards compatibility with older cd players) so ripping backups of your CD's is still legal. To back that story up, I've had copy protected CD's that Microsoft's Media Player ripped just fine. That's generally a good indication that doing so is legal, as Microsoft is careful to avoid creating software that can bring on lawsuits.

    Most of the Sony rootkits actually came from Sony movies. Back then, it was legal to backup ALL DVD's that you owned, regardless of encryption. Thus came a little startup called 3-2-1 studios that sold DVD backup software on the shelves. It was called DVD X-Copy (I think). You could buy it off the shelf at Best Buy, so yeah, it was legal. Everyone started acquiring the software to bootleg videos from the movie rental shops. DVD sales declined, and as a result, the movie companies cried foul and issued suits. That is what led up to the DCMA becoming law.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Amiga City - The BBS for the Amiga - more than 2,500+ files
  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Vk3jed on Thursday, June 07, 2018 05:09:48
    Re: Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Thu Jun 07 2018 09:20:00

    software to rip a movie, technically I'd think it wasn't you who cracked the copy protection; it was someone else who did that..

    Hmm, I very much doubt that argument would stand up in court. (IANAL, of course).

    Under US law, even obtaning the software to break the encryption is illegal. I'm not certain where NightFox is from, however.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Amiga City - The BBS for the Amiga - more than 2,500+ files
  • From Jagossel@VERT/MTLGEEK to MRO on Thursday, June 07, 2018 08:33:08
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: MRO to Jagossel on Wed Jun 06 2018 22:14:01

    Random thought: anyone remember MusicMatch?

    yeah i used musicmatch jukebox.
    it was a good program for a while.

    Thank you for reminding me what exactly it was! I remember it being slick-looking. I think I was using MusicMatch before WinAmp.

    -jag
    Code it, Script it, Automate it!

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ MtlGeek - Geeks in Montreal - http://mtlgeek.com/ -
  • From Jagossel@VERT/MTLGEEK to Chai on Thursday, June 07, 2018 08:42:19
    Re: Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Chai to Vk3jed on Thu Jun 07 2018 04:41:21

    It's not illegal to store a backup of the DVD. It's just illegal to circumvent DVD encryption to do so. Either way, they got you.

    But for making it compatible with another playback device you own? Hmm, there's a lawyers picnic waiting to happen! :D

    Well, I'm quoting American law. And presumably, I haven't researched copyri law in some time, so my info may be dated. But, yes, breaking any encryptio meant to apply copy protection for copyrighted material is illegal (in the U I believe, however, it falls under civil law. They would have to sue you, unless you upload it to a file sharing service or something contributing to sufficient damages. I remember the stories of 13 year olds being hit with outrageous fines due to record companies filing suits over file sharing mp3' That hasn't happened in awhile (to my knowledge), but music is so cheap anyw It's better just to buy or subscribe. Less risk of getting malware that way and it is the right thing to do. IMHO.

    I completely agree with you; it's the same, "better safe than sorry", stance that I take when it come to IP. It the reason why I enjoy using free (primarily libre, then gratis) and open source software: no need to worry about paying $100's for a single licence that I can only use in one place. It is the same reason why I try to get into downloading Creative Commons content as well, but let's be honest: sometimes, commercial content is better.

    -jag
    Code it, Script it, Automate it!

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ MtlGeek - Geeks in Montreal - http://mtlgeek.com/ -
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Vk3jed on Thursday, June 07, 2018 09:14:48
    Re: Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Thu Jun 07 2018 09:20 am

    I'm wondering if it's legally okay to rip music CDs for your own
    use, since CDs don't use encryption.

    Again, depends on jurisdiction. I'm pretty confident that's legal here under the rules that allow media conversion. Of course, the unstated assumption is you own the CDs in question, copying someone else's CD is illegal.

    Libraries here would often have a selection of music CDs that you could borrow. That lends itself to people borrowing the CDs and copying them before returning them. And of course there are those who might copy/rip rented movies. And along those lines, I've found that rented DVDs and blu-ray movies tend not to have any of the extras that are included on the version that is typically sold in stores. There is a chain of inexpensive movie rental kiosks in the US called RedBox (you can rent a movie for $1.50 or $2.00 per night, depending on whether it's DVD or blu-ray), and I've heard that if you keep the movie for 15 days or something, then you basically have the option to purchase the disc. If you do that, you'd end up owning a rental disc without any of the extras that would be included if you were to purchase the movie in a retail store.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Ed Vance on Thursday, June 07, 2018 09:21:39
    Re: Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Ed Vance to Nightfox on Wed Jun 06 2018 03:22 pm

    I wish I still had that old VCR now because Sony had Manufacturers of newer VCR's have to include 'their' DCMR 'protection circuitry' in all later VCR's.

    I learned about DCMR and what it does one day after I owned Two VCR's and had the A/V Output of one of them connected to the A/V Input of the second unit.

    We had just bought a VCR Movie at the Department Store and put the Cassette in the "Number One VCR" and when we tried to play it the image was scrambled up and we thought to take it back to the Store and get another copy that worked.

    I had heard of VCR copy protection. I don't remember if it was specifically Sony that put it out there or if it was the general industry that agreed on it.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Jagossel on Thursday, June 07, 2018 09:24:32
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Jagossel to Nightfox on Wed Jun 06 2018 10:13 pm

    Random thought: anyone remember MusicMatch?

    That sounds familiar. Some kind of media player? I think I had it installed on my PC for a little while, long ago.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Thursday, June 07, 2018 09:28:37
    Re: Copy Protection CD's
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Thu Jun 07 2018 04:56 am

    Most of the Sony rootkits actually came from Sony movies. Back then, it was legal to backup ALL DVD's that you owned, regardless of encryption. Thus came a little startup called 3-2-1 studios that sold DVD backup software on the shelves. It was called DVD X-Copy (I think). You could buy it off the shelf at Best Buy, so yeah, it was legal. Everyone started acquiring the software to bootleg videos from the movie rental shops. DVD sales declined, and as a result, the movie companies cried foul and issued suits. That is what led up to the DCMA becoming law.

    That makes me wonder why it was only when DVDs were around that the DMCA came into law? People had been able to copy various forms of media long before DVDs came around. Did sales of music CDs, cassettes, etc. not suffer enough for them to enact anti-copying laws at the time?

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Thursday, June 07, 2018 09:37:38
    Re: Software
    By: Chai to Vk3jed on Thu Jun 07 2018 05:09 am

    Under US law, even obtaning the software to break the encryption is illegal. I'm not certain where NightFox is from, however.

    I'm from the US.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Vk3jed on Thursday, June 07, 2018 09:47:38
    Re: Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Nightfox to Vk3jed on Thu Jun 07 2018 09:14 am

    Again, depends on jurisdiction. I'm pretty confident that's legal
    here under the rules that allow media conversion. Of course, the
    unstated assumption is you own the CDs in question, copying someone
    else's CD is illegal.

    Another thing I was thinking of - In the US, it has always been legal to rent movies, CDs, video games for consoles, etc., but generally I believe it is illegal to rent computer software. At least, renting computer software has been a grey area. I remember there being a couple places in my area that rented computer games & other software a long time ago, but those places were shut down. Sometimes people would go and rent computer software and make copies of it. But since many commercial computer programs have serial numbers, I suppose that would make it difficult for rentals to make sense (software makers want people to purchase the software). I've often thought it was interesting that renting computer software is illegal or frowned upon, but renting music CDs and movies is perfectly legal - People could easily rent music or a movie and copy it.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Jagossel on Thursday, June 07, 2018 20:17:26
    Re: Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Jagossel to Chai on Thu Jun 07 2018 08:42:19

    I completely agree with you; it's the same, "better safe than sorry", stance about paying $100's for a single licence that I can only use in one place. It is the same reason why I try to get into downloading Creative Commons content as well, but let's be honest: sometimes, commercial content is better.


    This is true. The raw power of Excel, Photoshop, Premiere... The talent tends to follow the money.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Amiga City - The BBS for the Amiga - more than 2,500+ files
  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Nightfox on Thursday, June 07, 2018 20:34:34
    Re: Copy Protection CD's
    By: Nightfox to Chai on Thu Jun 07 2018 09:28:37

    That makes me wonder why it was only when DVDs were around that the DMCA came into law? People had been able to copy various forms of media long before DVDs came around. Did sales of music CDs, cassettes, etc. not suffer enough for them to enact anti-copying laws at the time?

    Well, if memory serves, it was a quality/technology issue.

    Cassette Dubs: Poor reproduction.
    VHS to VHS: Also, poor reproduction.
    Video Disc: I don't recall a consumer grade recorder. The tech kinda bombed. DVD X-Copy: Some degradation due to higher compression, but good enough.
    It was the first feasible alternative to a store bought video.

    Cassettes had copy protection, if you can call it that. They had a little notch that if it was missing, the tape recorder wouldn't dub it. People just put a piece of tape over the hole to get around it.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Amiga City - The BBS for the Amiga - more than 2,500+ files
  • From Digital Man@VERT to Chai on Thursday, June 07, 2018 16:18:55
    Re: Copy Protection CD's
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Thu Jun 07 2018 08:34 pm

    Cassettes had copy protection, if you can call it that. They had a little notch that if it was missing, the tape recorder wouldn't dub it. People just put a piece of tape over the hole to get around it.

    You're thinking of the record-prection tab - nothing to do with copy protection.

    digital man

    Synchronet "Real Fact" #61:
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  • From Hawkeye@VERT/MASHBBS to Nightfox on Thursday, June 07, 2018 19:35:58
    Re: Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Nightfox to Vk3jed on Tue Jun 05 2018 20:17:00

    Depends where you are. In Australia, you are allowed to convert media formats for compatibility with your own playback devices, so if you
    Is that true even for encrypted discs? Normally, DVD and blu-ray discs have encryption to try to prevent people from ripping them.

    Here in The Netherlands we can and may too, we even pay extra taxes on empty media like DVDs, USB sticks, cassettes, etc.... because of this we are legally permitted to use copies for ourself. You may not lent them of sell them. SO sharing my Plex library with other than my household is illegal, witin it's not. We are allowed to download music and movies but not upload it.

    I download 1-1.5 TB per month and I never got a letter of my ISP I broke the FUP. Also my friends never got this. I'm happy with this. Friends who leave in Belgium, our neighbor country have data limits per month!


    HAWKEYE

    - MASH BBS - mash4077.ddns.net - The Netherlands -

    ---
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  • From Hawkeye@VERT/MASHBBS to Chai on Thursday, June 07, 2018 19:42:17
    Re: Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Chai to Vk3jed on Thu Jun 07 2018 04:41:21

    It's not illegal to store a backup of the DVD. It's just illegal to circumvent DVD encryption to do so. Either way, they got you.

    I just check it for the Netherlands, we may copy for ourself but we are not allowed to circumvent any protection. The good thing is, on internet the already ripped versions are available, I don't have to use decryption software so I'm ok :)

    HAWKEYE

    - MASH BBS - mash4077.ddns.net - The Netherlands -

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ MASH4077.DDNS.NET - MASH BBS - The Netherlands
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Thursday, June 07, 2018 17:07:24
    Re: Copy Protection CD's
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Thu Jun 07 2018 08:34 pm

    bombed. DVD X-Copy: Some degradation due to higher compression, but good enough.
    It was the first feasible alternative to a store bought video.

    I remember there being a free software called DVD Shrink that could copy DVDs. As its name implies, it could shrink 9.x GB DVDs to fit on a 4.7GB DVD, but it also had an option not to compress it so you could copy the DVD as-is onto a double-sided DVD writeable disc. I don't know if DVD Shrink came out before or after DVD X-Copy though.

    Cassettes had copy protection, if you can call it that. They had a little notch that if it was missing, the tape recorder wouldn't dub it. People just put a piece of tape over the hole to get around it.

    That's a fairly easy copy protection to get around. I always thought that
    more of a way to prevent accidentally recording over something, rather than to prevent illegal music copying. Someone might want to record audio of their own music they made, or some other personal recording and then remove the tab so it couldn't easily be recorded over. And of course, if you bought a cassette album, you wouldn't want to accidentally record over it.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Hawkeye on Thursday, June 07, 2018 17:13:42
    Re: Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Hawkeye to Nightfox on Thu Jun 07 2018 07:35 pm

    Here in The Netherlands we can and may too, we even pay extra taxes on empty media like DVDs, USB sticks, cassettes, etc.... because of this we are legally permitted to use copies for ourself. You may not lent them of sell them. SO sharing my Plex library with other than my household is illegal, witin it's not. We are allowed to download music and movies but not upload it.

    I guess it's technically illegal to use BitTorrent to download music & movies then, since you will also be uploading it to other users?

    I download 1-1.5 TB per month and I never got a letter of my ISP I broke the FUP. Also my friends never got this. I'm happy with this. Friends who leave in Belgium, our neighbor country have data limits per month!

    I'm not a fan of monthly data limits. I don't really see the point in them limiting how much data you can use. The only reason I can think of is so that they can artificailly charge you more money for a higher data limit.

    Nightfox

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    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Thursday, June 07, 2018 17:21:00
    Re: Commercial Content
    By: Chai to Jagossel on Thu Jun 07 2018 08:17 pm

    stance about paying $100's for a single licence that I can only use in
    one place. It is the same reason why I try to get into downloading
    Creative Commons content as well, but let's be honest: sometimes,
    commercial content is better.

    This is true. The raw power of Excel, Photoshop, Premiere... The talent tends to follow the money.

    Sometimes, "you get what you pay for" is true, but sometimes that doesn't really apply. One example is Linux - IMO Linux is a really good OS and there are many free Linux distros out there. And I am reminded of a job interview I once had where the interviewer asked me what I think about Linux. He said he didn't trust Linux because since it's open-source, he thought anyone could go in and put malware into Linux. He trusted Windows more, because there's a smaller dedicated team of people who are paid to work on Windows. I am fairly sure there are people who review code going into Linux and wouldn't allow malware in, and if malware does happen to slip in, I'm sure it would be corrected very fast.

    Nightfox

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    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Jagossel@VERT/FRUGALBB to Nightfox on Thursday, June 07, 2018 20:44:32
    Re: Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Nightfox to Vk3jed on Thu Jun 07 2018 09:14 am

    ... There is a chain of inexpensive movie rental kiosks in the US
    called RedBox (you can rent a movie for $1.50 or $2.00 per night, depending whether it's DVD or blu-ray), and I've heard that if you keep the movie for days or something, then you basically have the option to purchase the disc. you do that, you'd end up owning a rental disc without any of the extras tha would be included if you were to purchase the movie in a retail store.

    Man alive! RedBox... came in handy when didn't have the Internet. $2/night wasn't a bed deal either. I've heard that you could buy the movie to keep, might as well if you just paid $30 after 15 days!

    -jag
    Code it, Script it, Automate it!

    ---
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Jagossel on Thursday, June 07, 2018 19:52:13
    Re: Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Jagossel to Nightfox on Thu Jun 07 2018 08:44 pm

    Man alive! RedBox... came in handy when didn't have the Internet. $2/night wasn't a bed deal either. I've heard that you could buy the movie to keep, might as well if you just paid $30 after 15 days!

    I wouldn't buy RedBox movies though.. Their copies don't have any of the extras that are often included with the movies sold in stores.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Chai on Thursday, June 07, 2018 22:33:41
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Thu Jun 07 2018 04:21 am

    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Nightfox to Chai on Tue Jun 05 2018 16:19:42

    Since music CDs don't use encryption, I suppose there's no legal problem with ripping your own CDs for your own personal use?

    That's correct. As long as you don't distribute/upload the music file, ripping CD's is perfectly legal. At least, that is my understanding.



    if you crack DRM , that is illegal. that would mean dvds, blurays.
    i'm not sure if that pertains to protected cds.

    usually they say making a copy for your own use is fine.

    but who still uses cds? i dont think i've bought one in 18 years!
    ---
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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Jagossel on Thursday, June 07, 2018 22:36:39
    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Jagossel to MRO on Thu Jun 07 2018 08:33 am

    Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: MRO to Jagossel on Wed Jun 06 2018 22:14:01

    Random thought: anyone remember MusicMatch?

    yeah i used musicmatch jukebox.
    it was a good program for a while.

    Thank you for reminding me what exactly it was! I remember it being slick-looking. I think I was using MusicMatch before WinAmp.



    it had skins later on and it was very feature rich. i think i even used it for shoutcasting music.
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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Nightfox on Thursday, June 07, 2018 22:45:08
    Re: Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Nightfox to Vk3jed on Thu Jun 07 2018 09:14 am


    Libraries here would often have a selection of music CDs that you could borrow. That lends itself to people borrowing the CDs and copying them before returning them. And of course there are those who might copy/rip rented movies. And along those lines, I've found that rented DVDs and


    i used to do that and we had a program where we could share content with other libraries in my state. they had trucks driving back and forth all day. i got some stuff that was very rare..
    ripping that stuff takes a lot of time, though.
    ---
    þ Synchronet þ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Nightfox on Thursday, June 07, 2018 22:53:15
    Re: Commercial Content
    By: Nightfox to Chai on Thu Jun 07 2018 05:21 pm

    thought anyone could go in and put malware into Linux. He trusted Windows more, because there's a smaller dedicated team of people who are paid to work on Windows. I am fairly sure there are people who review code going into Linux and wouldn't allow malware in, and if malware does happen to slip in, I'm sure it would be corrected very fast.


    you mean like heartbleed and other stuff that sat around for years?
    ---
    þ Synchronet þ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From Denn@VERT/OUTWEST to Chai on Thursday, June 07, 2018 23:02:00
    Re: Copy Protection CD's
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Thu Jun 07 2018 04:56 am

    Most of the Sony rootkits actually came from Sony movies. Back then, it was legal to backup ALL DVD's that you owned, regardless of encryption. Thus came a little startup called 3-2-1 studios that sold DVD backup software on the shelves. It was called DVD X-Copy (I think). You could buy it off the shelf at Best Buy, so yeah, it was legal. Everyone started acquiring the software to bootleg videos from the movie rental shops. DVD sales declined, and as a result, the movie companies cried foul and issued suits. That is what led up to the DCMA becoming law.

    Slysoft ANY DVD and DVDcopy 2 were way better than 321 studios and DVD X-copy. AnyDVD romoves incryption and then DVDcopy2 would make a backup in like 5 minutes.
    I use ANYDVD and Hanbrake to make my DVD's into MP4 and MKV about 5 to 10 minutes using my i5 quad core.

    ... Some people wear Superman pajamas. Superman wears Chuck Norris pajamas.

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  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Digital Man on Friday, June 08, 2018 03:09:35
    Re: Copy Protection CD's
    By: Digital Man to Chai on Thu Jun 07 2018 16:18:55

    You're thinking of the record-prection tab - nothing to do with copy protection.

    I was thinking I had a dubbing machine that wouldn't record from tapes that didn't have the tab. Perhaps I remember incorrectly. I don't recall back that far vividly enough to say for sure.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Amiga City - The BBS for the Amiga - more than 2,500+ files
  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Nightfox on Friday, June 08, 2018 03:42:17
    Re: Copy Protection CD's
    By: Nightfox to Chai on Thu Jun 07 2018 17:07:24

    as-is onto a double-sided DVD writeable disc. I don't know if DVD Shrink came out before or after DVD X-Copy though.

    DVD Shrink was after. It seems like I remember 3-2-1 studios being shut down from the lawsuit, and DVD Shrink was born afterwards. I'll have to research that on Wikipedia to be sure.

    Cassettes had copy protection, if you can call it that. They had a

    That's a fairly easy copy protection to get around. I always thought that more of a way to prevent accidentally recording over something, rather than to prevent illegal music copying. Someone might want to record audio of their own music they made, or some other personal recording and then remove the tab so it couldn't easily be recorded over. And of course, if you bought a cassette album, you wouldn't want to accidentally record over it.

    Someone is telling me that it had nothing to do with copy protection. They may be right. I was extremely young when I had cassettes, so my memory may be a little off. I was thinking that I had a dub machine that wouldn't copy unless you taped the hole, but he may be right in that its sole purpose was to prevent accidental record overs.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Amiga City - The BBS for the Amiga - more than 2,500+ files
  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Nightfox on Friday, June 08, 2018 04:09:11
    Re: Commercial Content
    By: Nightfox to Chai on Thu Jun 07 2018 17:21:00

    Sometimes, "you get what you pay for" is true, but sometimes that doesn't really apply. One example is Linux - IMO Linux is a really good OS and there are many free Linux distros out there. And I am reminded of a job

    I'm using Ubuntu budgie as I write this message. I'm somewhat new to Linux. I like it, so far. It allows me to do all of my web surfing on my $200 laptop without any lag. If I boot Windows, the machine slows to a crawl. So, I am finding Linux to be an efficient OS. It seems to have a lot of bugs, though. That will be less of an issue once I'm proficient with the OS. Right now, if I experience a problem, I have to hunt for the answer on Google. The answer I'm looking for may or may not be out there. Getting USB WiFi adapters to work is problematic. Sometimes, I wonder if they wouldn't do better to focus all of their efforts on one distro, and make it as polished as non-free OS's. But then again, that's also one of Linux's strengths. It can be customized to any need.

    Linux. He said he didn't trust Linux because since it's open-source, he thought anyone could go in and put malware into Linux. He trusted Windows more, because there's a smaller dedicated team of people who are paid to work on Windows. I am fairly sure there are people who review code going into Linux and wouldn't allow malware in, and if malware does happen to slip

    I think Linux's track record on being MalWare free has been pretty good, actually. That's amazing considering how many lines of code exist in an entire distro (lot's of code to look at and verify). I have noticed some recent posts in forums warning against using unverified PPA's to install compiled software. I'm not sure if they are just being careful, or if they've actually had incidents. It's not always obvious to me if a PPA is trustworthy or not.

    I'm guessing you've heard that Microsoft acquired Github.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Amiga City - The BBS for the Amiga - more than 2,500+ files
  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Chai on Thursday, June 07, 2018 18:58:00
    Chai wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    Well, I'm quoting American law. And presumably, I haven't researched copyright law in some time, so my info may be dated. But, yes,
    breaking any encryption meant to apply copy protection for copyrighted material is illegal (in the US). I believe, however, it falls under
    civil law. They would have to sue you, unless you upload it to a file sharing service or something contributing to sufficient damages. I remember the stories of 13 year olds being hit with outrageous fines
    due to record companies filing suits over file sharing mp3's. That
    hasn't happened in awhile (to my knowledge), but music is so cheap
    anyway. It's better just to buy or subscribe. Less risk of getting malware that way, and it is the right thing to do. IMHO.

    Yes, the music industry eventually got it - provide the right product that people want in a convenient way, at a good price and with no encumbrances, and guess what! people will generally pay for it! iTunes has certainly made buying music simple and affordable.

    The movie industry haven't quite got it yet, they're still using some outdated models but they will, eventually.


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  • From Jagossel@VERT/MTLGEEK to Chai on Friday, June 08, 2018 08:58:57
    Re: Commercial Content
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Fri Jun 08 2018 04:09:11

    I'm guessing you've heard that Microsoft acquired Github.

    I work in a Microsoft-based software shop (using C#/.NET), and I follow Visual Studio, Visual Studio Code, and Visual Studio Subscriptions on Twitter: it was hard for me to miss it.

    I'm curious on what that will mean between Visual Studio Team Services and GitHub, other than having the ability to do builds and tests automatically.

    -jag
    Code it, Script it, Automate it!

    ---
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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Chai on Friday, June 08, 2018 06:16:13
    Re: Copy Protection CD's
    By: Chai to Digital Man on Fri Jun 08 2018 03:09 am

    I was thinking I had a dubbing machine that wouldn't record from tapes that didn't have the tab. Perhaps I remember incorrectly. I don't recall back that far vividly enough to say for sure.

    If that were the case, I'd suspect I have some "HAK UR DUBB1NG MACHIN3Z "l33t files in my file area from back then.

    ---
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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Chai on Friday, June 08, 2018 06:19:26
    Re: Commercial Content
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Fri Jun 08 2018 04:09 am

    I'm using Ubuntu budgie as I write this message. I'm somewhat new to Linux. I like it, so far. It allows me to do all of my web surfing on my $200 laptop without any lag. If I boot Windows, the machine slows to a crawl.

    Yeah, I have an IBM Thinkpad T42 with 2 GB of RAM that sort of runs Windows XP, but it runs Lubuntu (a version of Ubuntu with lightweight apps) perfectly. Those laptops are $30 or so on eBay now.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to MRO on Friday, June 08, 2018 10:18:01
    Re: Commercial Content
    By: MRO to Nightfox on Thu Jun 07 2018 10:53 pm

    thought anyone could go in and put malware into Linux. He trusted
    Windows more, because there's a smaller dedicated team of people who
    are paid to work on Windows. I am fairly sure there are people who
    review code going into Linux and wouldn't allow malware in, and if
    malware does happen to slip in, I'm sure it would be corrected very
    fast.

    you mean like heartbleed and other stuff that sat around for years?

    We have discussed this before.. But I still suspect that was a bug and doubt anyone intentionally put that in. Sometimes bugs can linger for years before they are discovered.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Friday, June 08, 2018 10:20:31
    Re: Copy Protection CD's
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Fri Jun 08 2018 03:42 am

    That's a fairly easy copy protection to get around. I always thought
    that more of a way to prevent accidentally recording over something,
    rather than to prevent illegal music copying. Someone might want to
    record audio of their own music they made, or some other personal
    recording and then remove the tab so it couldn't easily be recorded
    over. And of course, if you bought a cassette album, you wouldn't
    want to accidentally record over it.

    Someone is telling me that it had nothing to do with copy protection. They may be right. I was extremely young when I had cassettes, so my memory may be a little off. I was thinking that I had a dub machine that wouldn't copy unless you taped the hole, but he may be right in that its sole purpose was to prevent accidental record overs.

    Nope, those holes did not prevent you from copying the tape, only from re-recording onto that tape. To copy the tape, you would be playing that tape and recording onto a different tape, and there was nothing to prevent the machine from recording onto the other tape (unless that other tape had those tabs missing).

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Friday, June 08, 2018 10:25:13
    Re: Commercial Content
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Fri Jun 08 2018 04:09 am

    I'm using Ubuntu budgie as I write this message. I'm somewhat new to Linux. I like it, so far. It allows me to do all of my web surfing on my $200 laptop without any lag. If I boot Windows, the machine slows to a crawl. So, I am finding Linux to be an efficient OS. It seems to have a lot of bugs, though. That will be less of an issue once I'm proficient

    What kind of bugs? Linux has been around for a long time (so it's fairly mature), and usually I think the distro makers do a pretty good job of making sure the distro works well. When I use Linux, typically I don't run into random bugs.

    Years ago, I liked to try out different Linux distros, and it used to be that one version of a distro would install and work fairly well, but when I tried to install a newer version of the same distro, the newer version would seem fairly buggy (it wouldn't be able to detect my graphics card anymore, etc.). I used to wonder why they seemed to introduce issues in newer versions of a distro when the previous one worked well. But these days I haven't seen issues like that anymore with Linux distros.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Nightfox on Friday, June 08, 2018 16:13:23
    Re: Commercial Content
    By: Nightfox to MRO on Fri Jun 08 2018 10:18 am

    thought anyone could go in and put malware into Linux. He trusted
    Windows more, because there's a smaller dedicated team of people who
    are paid to work on Windows. I am fairly sure there are people who
    review code going into Linux and wouldn't allow malware in, and if
    malware does happen to slip in, I'm sure it would be corrected very
    fast.

    you mean like heartbleed and other stuff that sat around for years?

    We have discussed this before.. But I still suspect that was a bug and doubt anyone intentionally put that in. Sometimes bugs can linger for years before they are discovered.


    you know the us govt was benefitting from heartbleed as well as other countries and computer criminals. why do you assume someone didnt intentionally put this in? it's a very advantagious mistake, if it was all an accident.
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  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Denn on Saturday, June 09, 2018 01:05:31
    Re: Copy Protection CD's
    By: Denn to Chai on Thu Jun 07 2018 23:02:00

    Slysoft ANY DVD and DVDcopy 2 were way better than 321 studios and DVD X-copy. AnyDVD romoves incryption and then DVDcopy2 would make a backup in like 5 minutes.
    I use ANYDVD and Hanbrake to make my DVD's into MP4 and MKV about 5 to 10 minutes using my i5 quad core.


    SlySoft, I've heard of. DVDcopy 2 is new to me. I'm guessing those are newer technologies compared to 321 studios. 321 studios is pretty old school. It wasn't anything spectacular in terms of software, but I think it was one of the first available.

    I would prefer to be able to buy movies in digital form that gets stored on my local machine. Streaming services such as Vudu are great, until you end up with crappy Internet. I suppose the movie companies prefer streaming, as it's easier to DRM? Just guessing. I don't watch movies all that much anymore. I occassionally buy a BluRay from Wal-Mart if I think a movie is good enough. Mainly, I watch it at the theater, and viewing it once is good enough for me.

    ---
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  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Vk3jed on Saturday, June 09, 2018 01:13:39
    Re: Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Vk3jed to Chai on Thu Jun 07 2018 18:58:00

    Yes, the music industry eventually got it - provide the right product that people want in a convenient way, at a good price and with no encumbrances, and guess what! people will generally pay for it! iTunes has certainly made buying music simple and affordable.

    And we certainly got a good bargain. I remember buying CD's in the 80's. I either had to buy the entire album at about $11, or if I was lucky, there would be a single on the shelf for about $4. I typically only wanted 1-2 songs from the entire album, so it ended up being expensive. Now, I just buy the songs I like for all of my devices, and avoid the songs I do not like.

    The movie industry haven't quite got it yet, they're still using some outdated models but they will, eventually.

    Sometimes change is slow. We tend to hold on to what we know, even when there's a better way.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Amiga City - The BBS for the Amiga - more than 2,500+ files
  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Jagossel on Saturday, June 09, 2018 01:33:12
    Re: Commercial Content
    By: Jagossel to Chai on Fri Jun 08 2018 08:58:57

    I'm curious on what that will mean between Visual Studio Team Services and GitHub, other than having the ability to do builds and tests automatically.


    Some people are afraid that Microsoft will enforce the usage of Visual Studio with GitHub. There are a lot of people walking around with questions in their heads. I honestly don't know what MS has up their sleeve. On the brighter side, it's possible that MS could make GitHub better. I guess we'll just have to wait and see.

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    þ Synchronet þ Amiga City - The BBS for the Amiga - more than 2,500+ files
  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to poindexter FORTRAN on Saturday, June 09, 2018 01:41:09
    Re: Commercial Content
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Chai on Fri Jun 08 2018 06:19:26

    $200 laptop without any lag. If I boot Windows, the machine slows to a crawl.

    Yeah, I have an IBM Thinkpad T42 with 2 GB of RAM that sort of runs Windows XP, but it runs Lubuntu (a version of Ubuntu with lightweight apps) perfectly. Those laptops are $30 or so on eBay now.

    And with fully modern capabilities, I might guess. I haven't tried Lubuntu. I've tried Linux Lite. I've also tried NeverWare CloudReady which is a Chromium build. I prefer a full linux distro though (like Lubuntu), as I can run GIMP when I need to.

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    þ Synchronet þ Amiga City - The BBS for the Amiga - more than 2,500+ files
  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Nightfox on Saturday, June 09, 2018 02:08:50
    Re: Commercial Content
    By: Nightfox to Chai on Fri Jun 08 2018 10:25:13

    What kind of bugs? Linux has been around for a long time (so it's fairly mature), and usually I think the distro makers do a pretty good job of

    Bug #1: Chrome for Ubuntu has stuttering issues on Twitch for about the first 60 seconds of a stream change, but YouTube runs fine, which has me baffled. Firefox does not stutter near as much, but it does do it occasionally. I have the save version number of Chrome installed on the same machine under Windows, and it does not stutter at all. Older versions of Ubuntu did not stutter either. It's only been happening since my upgrade to version 18LTS. My ping tests all look normal, so I don't suspect WiFi issues.

    Bug #2: CUPS auto discovery keeps reinstalling printer drivers every time I boot the machine. Additionally, I get error messages asking me to submit the info to Ubuntu, so there is some type of failure. I got around this by setting CUPS discovery off, and forcing manual installation of printer drivers.

    Bug #3: Sometimes it has issues with me switching audio devices, such as when I plug in a USB gaming headset. The issue only exists on my laptop, as my Linux desktop handles the same headset just fine.

    Bug #4: The budgie dock auto-hide only works 70% of the time. Sometimes it fails to go away.

    Bug #5: Linux doesn't handle multiple WiFi adapters on the same machine very well.

    Anyway, I'll spare you the rest of the bugs. That's just a few of the things I've ran into while running Ubuntu Linux. I had Manjaro for awhile. It was a nice distro, but the packages weren't always in synch. I think open cubic player wouldn't run, because the version of glib on the system was too new.
    I'm sure there's an easy fix. I just lack the experience to know what I'm doing without breaking things. I'll get there eventually.

    I may switch to Debian stable. I understand that Ubuntu is based off of Debian testing. I don't know how much of a difference that would make.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Amiga City - The BBS for the Amiga - more than 2,500+ files
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Saturday, June 09, 2018 14:16:09
    Re: Linux Bugs
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Sat Jun 09 2018 02:08 am

    Bug #1: Chrome for Ubuntu has stuttering issues on Twitch for about the first 60 seconds of a stream change, but YouTube runs fine, which has me baffled. Firefox does not stutter near as much, but it does do it occasionally. I have the save version number of Chrome installed on the same machine under Windows, and it does not stutter at all. Older versions of Ubuntu did not stutter either. It's only been happening since my upgrade to version 18LTS. My ping tests all look normal, so I don't suspect WiFi issues.

    Bug #2: CUPS auto discovery keeps reinstalling printer drivers every time I boot the machine. Additionally, I get error messages asking me to submit the info to Ubuntu, so there is some type of failure. I got around this by setting CUPS discovery off, and forcing manual installation of printer drivers.

    Bug #3: Sometimes it has issues with me switching audio devices, such as when I plug in a USB gaming headset. The issue only exists on my laptop, as my Linux desktop handles the same headset just fine.

    Bug #4: The budgie dock auto-hide only works 70% of the time. Sometimes it fails to go away.

    Bug #5: Linux doesn't handle multiple WiFi adapters on the same machine very well.

    Somehow, this doesn't surprise me.. Seems like Linux distros sometimes still have little glitches like this. I've been running Linux Mint on my server machine for quite a while and haven't noticed things like this, but then again, I only have one wifi card in the machine and I typically don't print from that machine, etc..

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Saturday, June 09, 2018 14:26:49
    Re: Media
    By: Chai to Vk3jed on Sat Jun 09 2018 01:13 am

    And we certainly got a good bargain. I remember buying CD's in the 80's. I either had to buy the entire album at about $11, or if I was lucky, there would be a single on the shelf for about $4. I typically only wanted 1-2 songs from the entire album, so it ended up being expensive. Now, I just buy the songs I like for all of my devices, and avoid the songs I do not like.

    You can buy used CDs for fairly cheap these days. I suppose it's because CDs aren't in as much demand as they used to be. For most CD albums I want to buy, I usually see a lot of good deals on used ones on Amazon, even in very good condition.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Chai@VERT/ECBBS to Nightfox on Saturday, June 09, 2018 19:53:00
    Nightfox wrote to Chai <=-

    You can buy used CDs for fairly cheap these days. I suppose it's
    because CDs aren't in as much demand as they used to be. For most CD albums I want to buy, I usually see a lot of good deals on used ones on Amazon, even in very good condition.


    The only time I use CDs is in my car, because I have to.
    I do not like fumbling with the disks, as they scratch easily.
    I'd like to have Amazon Echo technology in my car.
    Being able to pull up any song via voice command while driving would be a huge plus. Having access to my music streaming service in the car would also be nice.
    I can do this with my phone, but it is a pain to mess with.
    ... MultiMail, the new multi-platform, multi-format offline reader!
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  • From Operations@VERT/SECTONE to Nightfox on Saturday, June 09, 2018 17:25:08
    Re: Copy Protection CD's
    By: Nightfox to Chai on Fri Jun 08 2018 10:20 am

    Nope, those holes did not prevent you from copying the tape, only from re-recording onto that tape. To copy the tape, you would be playing that ta and recording onto a different tape, and there was nothing to prevent the machine from recording onto the other tape (unless that other tape had those tabs missing).

    Yep, I used to have a couple of those two cassette decks. Put one tape in the left side and copy it to the one on the right. One button copy and I think one of mine did it in double time. Those were the good days!

    ---
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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Chai on Sunday, June 10, 2018 08:22:00
    Chai wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    And we certainly got a good bargain. I remember buying CD's in the
    80's. I either had to buy the entire album at about $11, or if I was lucky, there would be a single on the shelf for about $4. I typically only wanted 1-2 songs from the entire album, so it ended up being expensive. Now, I just buy the songs I like for all of my devices, and avoid the songs I do not like.

    Exactly, and that is how to avoid piracy and make money. The music industry certainly found a solution, and besides it's also a LOT easier to go online and buy the tracks you want, instead of pirate them. Win-win.

    The movie industry haven't quite got it yet, they're still using some outdated models but they will, eventually.

    Sometimes change is slow. We tend to hold on to what we know, even
    when there's a better way.

    Sadly, that is true. Hopefully in the next 5-10 years, they will also wake up and a new golden age of movie distribution will start - no DRM, cheap movies and easy, worldwide availability through multiple channels. And the ebook publishers also need to get their at together. I like reading ebooks on a Kindle (the E-ink Kindles are very much like reading on paper), but trying to follow a series is a nightmare. I read a book from a large series a couple of years ago. I haven't read the sequel - why? Because I can't get it here in ebook form! Silly thing is I can get it in paperback, but that's not helpful when I'm in the moment. This inconsistent availability is a real problem in the ebook insustry ATM, and it has all the signs of being a distribution rights issue.

    As for ebook DRM, I do remove DRM for archival purposes using Calibre - the Calibre repository has 2 purposes - backup, as well as format conversion for device compatibility. The "active" copies on devices are the original DRM'd ones.


    ... hAS ANYONE SEEN MY cAPSLOCK KEY?
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  • From Dumas Walker@VERT/CAPCITY2 to CHAI on Sunday, June 10, 2018 09:07:00
    Bug #1: Chrome for Ubuntu has stuttering issues on Twitch for about the first 60 seconds of a stream change, but YouTube runs fine, which has me

    I am not too surprised that you are having issues with Ubuntu. I tried it
    a couple of times. Both times it seemed to work OK but, once it was time
    for a version upgrade, everything went haywire.

    I went back to debian on that machine.

    Ubuntu, IIRC, takes stuff from stable but also testing and (maybe)
    unstable, which means it has more recent versions of some things (vs. the parent, debian), but it also means that stuff does not always have all of
    the bugs worked out.

    I have found bugs in debian stuff, too, but it is less often and I have
    used it much, much longer than both of the ubuntu attempts combined.

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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Nightfox on Sunday, June 10, 2018 06:37:00
    Nightfox wrote to Chai <=-

    You can buy used CDs for fairly cheap these days. I suppose it's
    because CDs aren't in as much demand as they used to be. For most CD albums I want to buy, I usually see a lot of good deals on used ones on Amazon, even in very good condition.

    I remember several years back when the RIAA wanted to make it difficult to
    sell CDs, and actively blocked record stores from selling used CDs.

    There's a right of ownership issue; trying to somehow explain that when you bought a physical CD you bought a right-to-use license with second sale limitations didn't fly.



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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Chai on Sunday, June 10, 2018 06:40:00
    Chai wrote to Nightfox <=-

    The only time I use CDs is in my car, because I have to.

    I've gotten spoiled. My car has Pandora, Slacker Radio and iHeartRadio
    built in, and I have most of my music ripped to a 64GB USB stick that it
    plays. Voice command for playing and custom playlists. Bluetooth streaming
    from my phone. And this is on a Toyota, nothing fancy.


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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Sunday, June 10, 2018 12:24:38
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Sat Jun 09 2018 07:53 pm

    The only time I use CDs is in my car, because I have to.
    I do not like fumbling with the disks, as they scratch easily.

    I don't like fumbling with them either, but I still like to buy music on CD because it provides a lossless copy of the music. Usually I buy music on CD and then rip it to FLAC (lossless) for a backup and also convert it to MP3 for use in my car, cell phone, music server, etc. The CD also provides a sort of backup so that if I lose my music files, I could re-rip them again.

    I'd like to have Amazon Echo technology in my car.
    Being able to pull up any song via voice command while driving would be a huge plus. Having access to my music streaming service in the car would also be nice.
    I can do this with my phone, but it is a pain to mess with.

    I agree, even with voice on my phone, it can still be clumsy to use while driving. As far as something that requires internet connectivity (such as something like Amazon Echo), I have shied away from anything that would need internet built into my car because that probably means I'd need a cellular connection for my car, which would be one more thing to pay for.. Also, while driving, a cellular connection can be spotty, depending on where you are as you're driving, and it could get annoying for a music stream to cut out while you're trying to listen to it.

    Nightfox

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Operations on Sunday, June 10, 2018 12:28:19
    Re: Copy Protection CD's
    By: Operations to Nightfox on Sat Jun 09 2018 05:25 pm

    Yep, I used to have a couple of those two cassette decks. Put one tape in the left side and copy it to the one on the right. One button copy and I think one of mine did it in double time. Those were the good days!

    Yeah, I had one of those dual-cassette decks that could copy tapes quickly. One thing about cassettes also was that some cassette decks played at a slightly different speed than others (although they're supposed to all play at the same speed). One time I recorded one of my old cassette tapes onto my PC and made MP3s of the music, but there were some issues with the recording, so a couple years ago I bought a USB cassette player and re-recorded the cassette with that. I noticed that the USB cassette player I had bought played very slightly slower than the older cassette deck I had used before. Since the USB cassette player was new, I had a feeling the older cassette deck I had used probably played cassettes slightly too fast. With the older cassette deck, the songs were maybe a second or 2 longer and the audio was very slightly pitched up a little higher.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Operations@VERT/SECTONE to Nightfox on Monday, June 11, 2018 08:52:20
    Re: Copy Protection CD's
    By: Nightfox to Operations on Sun Jun 10 2018 12:28 pm

    Yeah, I had one of those dual-cassette decks that could copy tapes quickly. One thing about cassettes also was that some cassette decks played at a slightly different speed than others (although they're supposed to all play the same speed). One time I recorded one of my old cassette tapes onto my P and made MP3s of the music, but there were some issues with the recording, s couple years ago I bought a USB cassette player and re-recorded the cassette with that. I noticed that the USB cassette player I had bought played very slightly slower than the older cassette deck I had used before. Since the U cassette player was new, I had a feeling the older cassette deck I had used probably played cassettes slightly too fast. With the older cassette deck, songs were maybe a second or 2 longer and the audio was very slightly pitche up a little higher.

    Nightfox
    I never thought about that with the speed of the player. It would make sense that those little motors were probably never calibrated and different makes moved at different speeds. Of course none of us would have noticed unless we heard it played on another unit. They were probably all close enough in specs to make us think we were hearing the music right.

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  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Vk3jed on Monday, June 11, 2018 16:12:00
    Vk3jed wrote to Chai <=-


    As for ebook DRM, I do remove DRM for archival purposes using Calibre - the Calibre repository has 2 purposes - backup, as well as format conversion for device compatibility. The "active" copies on devices
    are the original DRM'd ones.

    It would be nice if I could convert my paperbacks to the Kindle. With
    movies, I can obtain a digital license via Vudu by running their
    software with the disc inserted. You cannot really do that with books
    for obvious reasons. My bookshelf is overstocked with thick books that I'd prefer to carry around on an ereader.

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  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Dumas Walker on Monday, June 11, 2018 16:24:00
    Dumas Walker wrote to CHAI <=-

    Ubuntu, IIRC, takes stuff from stable but also testing and (maybe) unstable, which means it has more recent versions of some things (vs.
    the parent, debian), but it also means that stuff does not always have
    all of the bugs worked out.

    I really like Elementary OS. When Juno comes out, I may give it a roll.
    I just downloaded a Debian Live ISO, and I'm fixing to test it out.

    I have found bugs in debian stuff, too, but it is less often and I have used it much, much longer than both of the ubuntu attempts combined.

    The bugs do not bother me, as long as I can figure out a fix for them.
    Every OS has at least some bugs.




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  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to poindexter FORTRAN on Monday, June 11, 2018 16:32:00
    poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Chai <=-


    I've gotten spoiled. My car has Pandora, Slacker Radio and iHeartRadio
    built in, and I have most of my music ripped to a 64GB USB stick that
    it
    plays. Voice command for playing and custom playlists. Bluetooth streaming
    from my phone. And this is on a Toyota, nothing fancy.

    My Toyota didn't come with any of that, but I've had it awhile. I could always put in a new stereo, though. Maybe, during the Christmas season.
    It would be worth it for the voice command.

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  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Nightfox on Monday, June 11, 2018 16:53:00
    Nightfox wrote to Chai <=-

    I don't like fumbling with them either, but I still like to buy music
    on CD because it provides a lossless copy of the music. Usually I buy music on CD and then rip it to FLAC (lossless) for a backup and also

    I can definitely tell the difference between CD quality and MP3. I had one
    of the sony mini discs, back when that was a thing. It was nice, because
    the protected case kept the media from scratching. However, to get the smaller disc size, they used ATRAC compression. It still sounded decent,
    but I always seemed to be able to tell a difference when comparing it to a CD.




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  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to poindexter FORTRAN on Monday, June 11, 2018 17:01:00
    poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Nightfox <=-

    I remember several years back when the RIAA wanted to make it difficult
    to sell CDs, and actively blocked record stores from selling used CDs.

    I do not remember that, but that's insane.

    There's a right of ownership issue; trying to somehow explain that when you bought a physical CD you bought a right-to-use license with second sale limitations didn't fly.

    That sounds about like the RIAA.



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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Monday, June 11, 2018 16:56:39
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Mon Jun 11 2018 04:53 pm

    I can definitely tell the difference between CD quality and MP3. I had one of the sony mini discs, back when that was a thing. It was nice, because the protected case kept the media from scratching. However, to get the smaller disc size, they used ATRAC compression. It still sounded decent, but I always seemed to be able to tell a difference when comparing it to a CD.

    I think you have better hearing than I do, or perhaps better audio equipment. I've always had a hard time telling the difference between uncompressed (CD) quality and even a 128kbit MP3. Perhaps I could if I was listening closely with good headphones or good audio equipment. A while ago, I re-compressed all my MP3s from my CDs to variable-bitrate MP3s, which I've heard are supposed to provide better overall audio quality while possibly saving some storage space. So perhaps it's harder to tell the difference with those. I used to often hear 128kbit as the standard where most people can't tell a difference, but these days I often hear of people compressing to 320kbit MP3. The drive space savings is less substantial, of course.. When I first discovered MP3s in the late 90s, I was amazed to see that typical MP3s (at the time) were about 1/10th the size of the .wav file ripped from the CD.

    Nightfox

    ---
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Monday, June 11, 2018 17:04:16
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Chai to Vk3jed on Mon Jun 11 2018 04:12 pm

    It would be nice if I could convert my paperbacks to the Kindle. With movies, I can obtain a digital license via Vudu by running their
    software with the disc inserted. You cannot really do that with books
    for obvious reasons. My bookshelf is overstocked with thick books that I'd prefer to carry around on an ereader.

    If you have a scanner, you should be able to scan your books and save them in PDF format (or similar format) for viewing on mobile devices. It might be time-consuming, but perhaps worth it if you think you'll read them on your e-reader. But it may be difficult to ensure the book is flat enough on the scanner so it doesn't cut off any of the text..

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Chai on Tuesday, June 12, 2018 09:47:00
    Chai wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    It would be nice if I could convert my paperbacks to the Kindle. With

    Same here, still got a lot of paperbacks too.

    movies, I can obtain a digital license via Vudu by running their
    software with the disc inserted. You cannot really do that with books
    for obvious reasons. My bookshelf is overstocked with thick books that I'd prefer to carry around on an ereader.

    Yes, the ereader is much more convenient. It's nice to be able to hop on a plane and have a whole library of books to choose from to read during the flight. :)


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Operations on Tuesday, June 12, 2018 10:18:00
    Operations wrote to Nightfox <=-

    I never thought about that with the speed of the player. It would make sense that those little motors were probably never calibrated and different makes moved at different speeds. Of course none of us would have noticed unless we heard it played on another unit. They were probably all close enough in specs to make us think we were hearing the music right.

    Yeah, there were a lot wider tolerances in the analogue days. Speed accuracy determined the overall pitch of playback, and there was some variation. A good trick was to play identical (as far as possible, e.g. store bought, or 2 copies made using the same setup), in 2 different players simultaneously. You get some really neat phasing effects, as the 2 copies beat against each other, and the phase relationship changes due to the slightly different playback speeds.

    Then there were the speed variations, called "wow" and "flutter". These specs referred to how stable the speed of the player was (whether film, tape, cassette or turntable), with wow being longer term variations, causing a "wow" pich altering effect if audible, while flutter was shorter term (fractions of a second) speed variations.

    Today's generation is spoiled, with playback being controlled by stable clock oscillators in the D/A converters. There are still slight speed differences, especially in devices like computer soundcards, which do cause some issues in systems that involve long term streaming, and also have constraints on latency.
    Telecommunications such as VoIP telephony and RoIP have to allow for this slight difference in sample rates and insert the occasional "dummy" sample or drop an occasional sample to prevent buffer underflow or overflow.


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Tuesday, June 12, 2018 12:15:00
    Nightfox wrote to Chai <=-

    I think you have better hearing than I do, or perhaps better audio equipment. I've always had a hard time telling the difference between uncompressed (CD) quality and even a 128kbit MP3. Perhaps I could if I

    Some people can reliably hear the effects of MP3 compression. I can on better equipment, though for generap listening purposes, especially in the car, the effects are not objectionable.

    was listening closely with good headphones or good audio equipment. A while ago, I re-compressed all my MP3s from my CDs to variable-bitrate MP3s, which I've heard are supposed to provide better overall audio quality while possibly saving some storage space. So perhaps it's

    I've found variable rate MP3 to be worse for me. I suspect that's a highly individual thing, as I know my sensory processing is often different to most people. I seem to be more sensitive to the lower bitrate artifacts in general, regardless of the complexity of the audio. Going below 128k is definitely a no-no (some variable bitrate coding does), because below this bitrate, pitch, pitch stability and tonal quality - things I'm particularly sensitive to are afected, and I perceive effects similar to HF ham radio on long paths. Perhaps that's part of the reason I'm so sensitive to these distortions.

    harder to tell the difference with those. I used to often hear 128kbit
    as the standard where most people can't tell a difference, but these
    days I often hear of people compressing to 320kbit MP3. The drive
    space savings is less substantial, of course.. When I first discovered MP3s in the late 90s, I was amazed to see that typical MP3s (at the
    time) were about 1/10th the size of the .wav file ripped from the CD.

    320k is definitely better, though 128k is "acceptable" for general purpose, non critical use.


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Tuesday, June 12, 2018 12:17:00
    Nightfox wrote to Chai <=-

    If you have a scanner, you should be able to scan your books and save
    them in PDF format (or similar format) for viewing on mobile devices.
    It might be time-consuming, but perhaps worth it if you think you'll
    read them on your e-reader. But it may be difficult to ensure the book
    is flat enough on the scanner so it doesn't cut off any of the text..

    Urk, images are a poor way to store printed material - wasteful of storage and they destroy the underlying structure that means features like search and indexing don't work. At least use an OCR, but then one has to check for correct character recognition and font rendering. :)


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  • From Chai@VERT/ECBBS to Nightfox on Monday, June 11, 2018 21:43:00
    Nightfox wrote to Chai <=-

    Re: Re: Media
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Mon Jun 11 2018 04:53 pm

    I can definitely tell the difference between CD quality and MP3. I had one of the sony mini discs, back when that was a thing. It was nice, because

    I think you have better hearing than I do, or perhaps better audio equipment. I've always had a hard time telling the difference between uncompressed (CD) quality and even a 128kbit MP3. Perhaps I could if I

    Well, first of all, I haven't purchased an MP3 since the Spotify era.
    The MP3's I do own probably are not 320kbit. I mainly stream my music
    these days, or I lookup the Vevo video on YouTube. You would be correct
    in that the sound system makes the difference. It was an expensive
    sound system, at the time. I don't know that I would be able to tell
    the difference using my headphones. It always seemed I could tell
    a difference with the highs and overall clarity. In theory, mainly
    inaudible parts of the audio spectrum are removed with MP3, but it still
    didn't quite sound the same to me.

    can't tell a difference, but these
    days I often hear of people compressing to 320kbit MP3. The drive
    space savings is less substantial, of course.. When I first discovered

    What do they run? About 10MB a song? That's still not bad given
    todays storage capabilities.

    When CD's first came out, they said the quality would exceed vinyl, yet
    people these days say the audio quality of vinyl is better. I imagine
    there are many perspectives out there on this issue.

    MP3s in the late 90s, I was amazed to see that typical MP3s (at the
    time) were about 1/10th the size of the .wav file ripped from the CD.

    Audio and video compression were absolutely life changing inventions.
    I'm just amazed that they can continue to find ways to improve the
    technology.

    -Chai-


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  • From Chai@VERT/ECBBS to Nightfox on Monday, June 11, 2018 21:48:00
    Nightfox wrote to Chai <=-

    If you have a scanner, you should be able to scan your books and save
    them in PDF format (or similar format) for viewing on mobile devices.
    It might be time-consuming, but perhaps worth it if you think you'll
    read them on your e-reader. But it may be difficult to ensure the book
    is flat enough on the scanner so it doesn't cut off any of the text..

    Most of them are programming books. I just can't picture myself
    scanning books of that size, as I'm not that patient. I just need to
    buy newer, updated ebooks and donate my old paperbacks to Goodwill.



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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Chai on Tuesday, June 12, 2018 20:13:00
    On 06-11-18 21:43, Chai wrote to Nightfox <=-

    When CD's first came out, they said the quality would exceed vinyl, yet people these days say the audio quality of vinyl is better. I imagine there are many perspectives out there on this issue.

    I seem to particularly sensitive to the imperfections of vinyl. Sure, good vinyl on a good turntable sounds reasonably good, but CDs on a good player always sound "cleaner".


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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Tuesday, June 12, 2018 09:25:25
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Mon Jun 11 2018 09:43 pm

    Well, first of all, I haven't purchased an MP3 since the Spotify era.

    I don't purchase MP3s, I still like to purchase music on CD (or FLAC format if possible, since FLAC is lossless). I can convert those to MP3 myself.

    can't tell a difference, but these
    days I often hear of people compressing to 320kbit MP3. The drive
    space savings is less substantial, of course.. When I first
    discovered

    What do they run? About 10MB a song? That's still not bad given
    todays storage capabilities.

    Depends on the length of the song, but usually about 5-10MB per song I suppose. I found that (at least with 128kbit), MP3s tended to be about 1MB per minute (whereas a WAV file tends to be about 10MB per minute).

    When CD's first came out, they said the quality would exceed vinyl, yet people these days say the audio quality of vinyl is better. I imagine there are many perspectives out there on this issue.

    Yeah, there are a lot of perspectives on that.. Theoretically I think CD quality should be able to provide better quality - The Nyquist theorem says thta if the sampling rate is at least double the highest frequency of the audio, it should be able to faithfully reproduce the original audio. I think part of the debate is whether the standard CD sampling rate of 44.1khz is enough. I also like that CDs don't have the hiss & pops & crackles of vinyl and they don't physically wear out when you play them.

    Nightfox

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Vk3jed on Tuesday, June 12, 2018 09:28:50
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Chai on Tue Jun 12 2018 08:13 pm

    I seem to particularly sensitive to the imperfections of vinyl. Sure, good vinyl on a good turntable sounds reasonably good, but CDs on a good player always sound "cleaner".

    I think that's true.
    A while ago I came across a company that makes a laser turntable to play vinyl records:
    http://www.elpj.com
    I'm curious how a brand-new unworn record would sound when played with a laser (which doesn't physically contact the record).

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Vk3jed on Tuesday, June 12, 2018 16:46:13
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Chai on Tue Jun 12 2018 08:13 pm

    On 06-11-18 21:43, Chai wrote to Nightfox <=-

    When CD's first came out, they said the quality would exceed vinyl, yet people these days say the audio quality of vinyl is better. I imagine there are many perspectives out there on this issue.

    I seem to particularly sensitive to the imperfections of vinyl. Sure, good vinyl on a good turntable sounds reasonably good, but CDs on a good player always sound "cleaner".


    nothing beats vinyl. i dont like records but i gotta give it credit where credit is due
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  • From Chai@VERT/ECBBS to Vk3jed on Tuesday, June 12, 2018 17:30:00
    Vk3jed wrote to Chai <=-

    On 06-11-18 21:43, Chai wrote to Nightfox <=-

    When CD's first came out, they said the quality would exceed vinyl, yet people these days say the audio quality of vinyl is better. I imagine there are many perspectives out there on this issue.

    I seem to particularly sensitive to the imperfections of vinyl. Sure, good vinyl on a good turntable sounds reasonably good, but CDs on a
    good player always sound "cleaner".

    I agree. Vinyl does seem to have a nice warm sound to it, but CDs are
    more crisp. I don't think I've ever heard vinyl on a nice sound system, however. And, as you say, the imperfections are a thing.



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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Tuesday, June 12, 2018 17:18:06
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Chai to Vk3jed on Tue Jun 12 2018 05:30 pm

    I agree. Vinyl does seem to have a nice warm sound to it, but CDs are more crisp. I don't think I've ever heard vinyl on a nice sound system, however. And, as you say, the imperfections are a thing.

    If you record a vinyl record on your PC and burn the audio to a CD, I wonder if it would or could sound the same. Or these days, you could just play the audio file on a device of your choosing.

    Nightfox

    ---
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  • From Dreamer@VERT to Nightfox on Tuesday, June 12, 2018 23:49:00
    Nightfox wrote to Chai <=-

    When CD's first came out, they said the quality would exceed vinyl, yet people these days say the audio quality of vinyl is better. I imagine there are many perspectives out there on this issue.

    Yeah, there are a lot of perspectives on that.. Theoretically I think
    CD quality should be able to provide better quality - The Nyquist
    theorem says thta if the sampling rate is at least double the highest frequency of the audio, it should be able to faithfully reproduce the original audio. I think part of the debate is whether the standard CD sampling rate of 44.1khz is enough. I also like that CDs don't have
    the hiss & pops & crackles of vinyl and they don't physically wear out when you play them.

    I think people are nostalgic for OLDER vinyl records. The main reason is
    likely the old mastering techniques. In the 80's and 90's, there was a huge drive for amplifying the waveforms past the point of clipping (see the "loudness wars", I think). It's always been a thing, but it got ridiculous
    once CD came out.

    With the advent of CD, a publisher could push the loudness even more. Then, they started remastering old releases on CD, and people started noticing over time that "older music" tended to sound better. Bass, strings, and vocals started having the same volume, but not as much "oompf". I'm sure some of
    those artists from the 70's intended their guitars to overpower the drums,
    or the screaming metal lyrics to overpower the guitars... but on a remastered album, it's pretty much all at the same volume and with some loss on certain sounds due to clipping.

    One last point, notice I emphasized OLDER vinyl. I suspect new re-releases
    are probably using the later remastered music, in which case it's going to sound worse compared to the original vinyl release.

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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 13, 2018 12:35:00
    On 06-12-18 09:28, Nightfox wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    I think that's true.
    A while ago I came across a company that makes a laser turntable to
    play vinyl records:

    I did see that, quite interesting. :)

    http://www.elpj.com
    I'm curious how a brand-new unworn record would sound when played with
    a laser (which doesn't physically contact the record).

    That would be interesting. It depends how much of the intermodulation is recorded into the disc, as opposed to being introduced in the playback process, where the laser should be a lot more accurate at tracking the groove, since there's no inertia (the mass of the photons being orders of magnitude less than that of a stylus).


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Chai on Wednesday, June 13, 2018 12:37:00
    On 06-12-18 17:30, Chai wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    I agree. Vinyl does seem to have a nice warm sound to it, but CDs are more crisp. I don't think I've ever heard vinyl on a nice sound
    system, however. And, as you say, the imperfections are a thing.

    The problem I have with the "warm" sound is it's "warm and fuzzy". I prefer a "cleaner" sound. And the best way to get a warm, clean sound is to go to a live classical performance - now THAT can't be beaten by any recording technology. :)


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 13, 2018 12:48:00
    On 06-12-18 09:25, Nightfox wrote to Chai <=-

    Yeah, there are a lot of perspectives on that.. Theoretically I think
    CD quality should be able to provide better quality - The Nyquist
    theorem says thta if the sampling rate is at least double the highest frequency of the audio, it should be able to faithfully reproduce the original audio. I think part of the debate is whether the standard CD sampling rate of 44.1khz is enough. I also like that CDs don't have
    the hiss & pops & crackles of vinyl and they don't physically wear out when you play them.

    There is a school of thought that humans are subconsciously sensitive to sound above 20 kHz, and I recall one make of CD player that let aliasing artifacts "leak" through, and that make it should "smoother". And some people (I was one of them, probably still on the borderline) are capable of _directly_ hearing frequencies higher than 20 kHz. Yes, I think the sample rate was set too low, though it was probably a good compromise for 1980s technology. It's a pity the spec didn't allow for multiple sample rates. 96 kHz sampled CDs might sound awesome all round.


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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 13, 2018 00:38:22
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to Chai on Tue Jun 12 2018 05:18 pm

    Re: Re: Media
    By: Chai to Vk3jed on Tue Jun 12 2018 05:30 pm

    I agree. Vinyl does seem to have a nice warm sound to it, but CDs are more crisp. I don't think I've ever heard vinyl on a nice sound system, however. And, as you say, the imperfections are a thing.

    If you record a vinyl record on your PC and burn the audio to a CD, I wonder if it would or could sound the same. Or these days, you could just play the audio file on a device of your choosing.



    anytime you make a copy, you are losing some of the original. it doesnt matter what medium you use.
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  • From Chai@VERT/ECBBS to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 13, 2018 02:08:00
    Nightfox wrote to Chai <=-

    If you record a vinyl record on your PC and burn the audio to a CD, I wonder if it would or could sound the same. Or these days, you could
    just play the audio file on a device of your choosing.

    I would think it would depend on what type of master that was used for
    the record. Some of the vinyl's they put out now are actually sourced
    from a digital master. So, you're listening to an analog device play a digitally sourced recording. It almost defeats the point of buying
    vinyl in the first place. You can, however, still obtain true analog
    vinyls.

    But to the effect of recording an analog vinyl to digital format, I
    would think you would notice some difference between the original
    and the digital recording. Do MP3's only play sound frequencies
    one bit at a time like CD's did?



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  • From Chai@VERT/ECBBS to Vk3jed on Wednesday, June 13, 2018 02:16:00
    Vk3jed wrote to Chai <=-

    On 06-12-18 17:30, Chai wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    The problem I have with the "warm" sound is it's "warm and fuzzy". I prefer a "cleaner" sound. And the best way to get a warm, clean sound
    is to go to a live classical performance - now THAT can't be beaten by
    any recording technology. :)

    Especially in a music hall with world class acoustics. Our orchestra
    sells very reasonable tickets. I especially like it when they have a
    movie night where they play the background music score in real time sync
    with the movie. I have no idea why that impresses me. A little Vivaldi
    is good for the soul, as well.



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  • From Hawkeye@VERT/MASHBBS to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 13, 2018 10:57:29
    Re: Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Nightfox to Hawkeye on Thu Jun 07 2018 17:13:42

    I guess it's technically illegal to use BitTorrent to download music & movies then, since you will also be uploading it to other users?

    Set upload ration to 0 and you don't upload, then its legal.

    Its a grey area but experts in NL wrote setting the upload ratio to 0 is ok.

    HAWKEYE

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  • From Hawkeye@VERT/MASHBBS to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 13, 2018 10:59:02
    Re: Re: Linux Laptop Ideas?
    By: Nightfox to Hawkeye on Thu Jun 07 2018 17:13:42

    I'm not a fan of monthly data limits. I don't really see the point in them limiting how much data you can use. The only reason I can think of is so that they can artificailly charge you more money for a higher data limit.

    Exactly. Especially now with online sevices as Netflix in 4k with multiple users in a household. Thats why the fake netneutrality has come.

    HAWKEYE

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  • From Hawkeye@VERT/MASHBBS to Chai on Wednesday, June 13, 2018 11:09:42
    Re: Commercial Content
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Fri Jun 08 2018 04:09:11

    I think Linux's track record on being MalWare free has been pretty good, actually. That's amazing considering how many lines of code exist in an

    Maybe check some security exploits/malware comparison sites. A lot of times Windows is patched fast, with Linux second and MacOS as last... Linux had in some cases 15% more exploits than Windows. Problem is, Windows is used by millions of devices more than Linux by consumers and so more noticable.

    HAWKEYE

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Dreamer on Wednesday, June 13, 2018 09:17:57
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Dreamer to Nightfox on Tue Jun 12 2018 11:49 pm

    I think people are nostalgic for OLDER vinyl records. The main reason is likely the old mastering techniques. In the 80's and 90's, there was a huge drive for amplifying the waveforms past the point of clipping (see the "loudness wars", I think). It's always been a thing, but it got ridiculous once CD came out.

    I've heard about that.. Would be interesting if they'd re-release some CD albums without doing that.

    Nightfox

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Vk3jed on Wednesday, June 13, 2018 09:22:24
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Wed Jun 13 2018 12:48 pm

    There is a school of thought that humans are subconsciously sensitive to sound above 20 kHz, and I recall one make of CD player that let aliasing artifacts "leak" through, and that make it should "smoother". And some people (I was one of them, probably still on the borderline) are capable of _directly_ hearing frequencies higher than 20 kHz. Yes, I think the sample rate was set too low, though it was probably a good compromise for 1980s technology. It's a pity the spec didn't allow for multiple sample rates. 96 kHz sampled CDs might sound awesome all round.

    I've heard of newer standards such as Super Audio CD and Audio DVD, which I believe offer higher sample rates (and surround sound), but I don't think those caught on. I haven't seen very many music discs in those formats.

    Nightfox

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  • From Chai@VERT/ECBBS to Hawkeye on Wednesday, June 13, 2018 11:38:00
    Hawkeye wrote to Chai <=-


    Nice to hear but I'm not sure KLM is representing The Netherlands correctly ;) Next time you are there, let me know. We grab a beer :)

    Defintely will do. :)



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  • From Digital Man@VERT to Vk3jed on Wednesday, June 13, 2018 12:21:22
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Wed Jun 13 2018 12:48 pm

    On 06-12-18 09:25, Nightfox wrote to Chai <=-

    Yeah, there are a lot of perspectives on that.. Theoretically I think CD quality should be able to provide better quality - The Nyquist theorem says thta if the sampling rate is at least double the highest frequency of the audio, it should be able to faithfully reproduce the original audio. I think part of the debate is whether the standard CD sampling rate of 44.1khz is enough. I also like that CDs don't have the hiss & pops & crackles of vinyl and they don't physically wear out when you play them.

    There is a school of thought that humans are subconsciously sensitive to sound above 20 kHz, and I recall one make of CD player that let aliasing artifacts "leak" through, and that make it should "smoother". And some people (I was one of them, probably still on the borderline) are capable of _directly_ hearing frequencies higher than 20 kHz. Yes, I think the sample rate was set too low, though it was probably a good compromise for 1980s technology. It's a pity the spec didn't allow for multiple sample rates.
    96 kHz sampled CDs might sound awesome all round.

    Right, and 44.1kHz was supposed to allow for accurate reproduction of wave forms up to 22kHz (the .1 added to accommodate anti-aliasing filters) - or 44.1 was chosen for compatibility with existing video equipment (depending on who you listen to).

    Larger (e.g. 24-bit) samples would have helped too. 24-bit 48kHz samples might (?) produce a more accurate analog waveform than 16-bit at 96kHz.

    DVD-Audio had promise, but it came about around the same time as mass-MP3 popularity (and iPods, iTunes, etc.) and the advancements in quantity (and portability) that the compressed file format/delivery technology provided beat out the advancements in quality that DVD-Audio offered.

    I've long stated that if the music industry would improve their product over the technology of the 60's, that would (have) helped combat piracy. But as bandwidths and storage formats improved, the mainstream music storage/delivery format did not and it became easier to pirate. I think iTunes (and the like) made streaming and (legal) downloading ubiquitous, and the observable quality was at least "good enough" for the masses, so there's been no widespread demand for improvement in the best available formats available. And now that 4K movies can be widely/easily pirated, that argument (improvement in quality of content for anti-piracy means) is over.

    Neil Young pushed HDCD for a time and a lot of bands now release their music in high-rez (e.g. 24/96) digital download formats, but so much more could be done: - more audio channels (e.g. for surround sound or re-mixing/karaoke/play-along) - commentary tracks (like director's/actor's commentary on movies)
    - synced lyrics
    - synced images (album art or whatever)

    Bands and record companies have toyed with some of these things, but they should (in my view) become the "norm", or I wished so. :-)

    digital man

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Digital Man on Wednesday, June 13, 2018 12:46:24
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Digital Man to Vk3jed on Wed Jun 13 2018 12:21 pm

    Neil Young pushed HDCD for a time and a lot of bands now release their music in high-rez (e.g. 24/96) digital download formats, but so much more could be done:
    - more audio channels (e.g. for surround sound or re-mixing/karaoke/ play-along)
    - commentary tracks (like director's/actor's commentary on movies) - synced lyrics
    - synced images (album art or whatever)

    Bands and record companies have toyed with some of these things, but they should (in my view) become the "norm", or I wished so. :-)

    It would be interesting if music included extras like that. But what specifically do you mean by synced images? These days, formats such as MP3 and FLAC etc. include metadata that includes album artwork. Many music players will show the album artwork (if there is artwork) when playing a song. Things like more audio channels and commentary tracks would be interesting, though I'm not sure if they'd be widely used. I don't know of many people who have a surround sound system (though I suppose that since cars often have multiple speakers, they could be used as a surround sound system).

    As far as commentary tracks, that might be something I'd listen to, but it seems most people usually don't make use of extras like that in movies, so I'm not sure how many would listen to a commentary track for music. I sometimes like to visit songfacts.com though, to see if there is any background information for various songs.

    Nightfox

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  • From Digital Man@VERT to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 13, 2018 14:12:11
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to Dreamer on Wed Jun 13 2018 09:17 am

    Re: Re: Media
    By: Dreamer to Nightfox on Tue Jun 12 2018 11:49 pm

    I think people are nostalgic for OLDER vinyl records. The main reason is likely the old mastering techniques. In the 80's and 90's, there was a huge drive for amplifying the waveforms past the point of clipping (see the "loudness wars", I think). It's always been a thing, but it got ridiculous once CD came out.

    I've heard about that.. Would be interesting if they'd re-release some CD albums without doing that.

    Rush's "Vapor Trails" was re-mixed and re-mastered with much less dynamic compression (and a better mix) - sounds like a new album now!

    digital man

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  • From Digital Man@VERT to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 13, 2018 14:27:46
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to Digital Man on Wed Jun 13 2018 12:46 pm

    Bands and record companies have toyed with some of these things, but they should (in my view) become the "norm", or I wished so. :-)

    It would be interesting if music included extras like that. But what specifically do you mean by synced images?

    Images that would change along with the music. Not video, but art-work. Rush released a 2112 DVD that had some animated story-line images sync'd with the songs and it was really cool (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5jwxrTqoEA). Imagine, at the minimum, your music player showing an image which correlates with the song being played (like the artwork you often see in CD lyric books) or even pertinent to the part of the song being played.

    These days, formats such as MP3
    and FLAC etc. include metadata that includes album artwork. Many music players will show the album artwork (if there is artwork) when playing a song.

    Yeah, and maybe those images could even change mid-song (I don't know), but it's certainly not the "norm".

    Things like more audio channels and commentary tracks would be
    interesting, though I'm not sure if they'd be widely used. I don't know of many people who have a surround sound system (though I suppose that since cars often have multiple speakers, they could be used as a surround sound system).

    You don't know of many people who have surround system? Really? Every TV viewing room in my house has surround sound (5.1 is a minimum) and that's not uncommon among my family and friends. "Sound bars" are popular now too and they count as surround sound (though I don't personally use htem).

    As far as commentary tracks, that might be something I'd listen to, but it seems most people usually don't make use of extras like that in movies, so I'm not sure how many would listen to a commentary track for music. I sometimes like to visit songfacts.com though, to see if there is any background information for various songs.

    I'd listen to it. At least once. :-)

    digital man

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Digital Man on Wednesday, June 13, 2018 15:34:57
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Digital Man to Nightfox on Wed Jun 13 2018 02:12 pm

    I've heard about that.. Would be interesting if they'd re-release
    some CD albums without doing that.

    Rush's "Vapor Trails" was re-mixed and re-mastered with much less dynamic compression (and a better mix) - sounds like a new album now!

    Yeah, I had the original version and bought the remixed version when it came out. It does sound like a new album.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Digital Man on Wednesday, June 13, 2018 15:40:22
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Digital Man to Nightfox on Wed Jun 13 2018 02:27 pm

    Images that would change along with the music. Not video, but art-work. Rush released a 2112 DVD that had some animated story-line images sync'd with the songs and it was really cool (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5jwxrTqoEA). Imagine, at the minimum, your music player showing an image which correlates with the song being played (like the artwork you often see in CD lyric books) or even pertinent to the part of the song being played.

    That could be interesting.

    You don't know of many people who have surround system? Really? Every TV viewing room in my house has surround sound (5.1 is a minimum) and that's not uncommon among my family and friends. "Sound bars" are popular now too and they count as surround sound (though I don't personally use htem).

    Yeah, I've known maybe one person/family who had a surround sound setup for their TV in their living room. We have a soundbar for one of our TVs, but it only has 2 speakers in it, so I wouldn't have thought it would be capable of surround sound.

    Nightfox

    ---
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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 13, 2018 19:05:05
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to Digital Man on Wed Jun 13 2018 03:40 pm


    Yeah, I've known maybe one person/family who had a surround sound setup for their TV in their living room. We have a soundbar for one of our TVs, but it only has 2 speakers in it, so I wouldn't have thought it would be capable of surround sound.



    i'm not a fan of surround sound. it's too distracting.
    we have had a 5.1 and now we just have a soundbar with two speakers.
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  • From Digital Man@VERT to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 13, 2018 20:37:37
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to Digital Man on Wed Jun 13 2018 03:40 pm

    Yeah, I've known maybe one person/family who had a surround sound setup for their TV in their living room. We have a soundbar for one of our TVs, but it only has 2 speakers in it, so I wouldn't have thought it would be capable of surround sound.

    Sound bars (no matter the number of speakers) usually provide some sort of "virtual" surround sound using DSPs that manipulate the audio to "fool" the human listener into hearing sounds from directions they're not physically coming from.
    https://www.howtogeek.com/336009/how-do-surround-sound-bars-work/

    Like the article says, they're better than the speakers built-into TVs (usually), but not as good as a true surround sound (e.g. 5.1) system.

    digital man

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  • From Digital Man@VERT to MRO on Wednesday, June 13, 2018 20:43:22
    Re: Re: Media
    By: MRO to Nightfox on Wed Jun 13 2018 07:05 pm

    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to Digital Man on Wed Jun 13 2018 03:40 pm


    Yeah, I've known maybe one person/family who had a surround sound setup for their TV in their living room. We have a soundbar for one of our TVs, but it only has 2 speakers in it, so I wouldn't have thought it would be capable of surround sound.



    i'm not a fan of surround sound. it's too distracting.

    What about when you're in a theater? Do you find it distracting then? It might just be that you had your signal levels imblanaced (e.g. too loud in the rear channels).

    we have had a 5.1 and now we just have a soundbar with two speakers.

    I had an excellent 7.1 system for about 10 years but found that hardly any content (movies) used the extra 2 channels and it was really not a very noticeable improvement (at least in 12 x 15' room). So when we moved and I set that system back up, I just went with 5.1 - less hassle.

    The kids and wife don't mind watching their shows or movies on tablets and phones, but I prefer to recline in front of a big screen and get the move-theater-level sound. So much better (for me).

    digital man

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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Chai on Thursday, June 14, 2018 18:57:00
    On 06-13-18 02:16, Chai wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    Especially in a music hall with world class acoustics. Our orchestra sells very reasonable tickets. I especially like it when they have a movie night where they play the background music score in real time
    sync with the movie. I have no idea why that impresses me. A little Vivaldi is good for the soul, as well.

    Yes, as I said, nothing beats a live acoustic performance - there's a warmth and clarity no recording system can capture.


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Thursday, June 14, 2018 18:59:00
    On 06-13-18 09:22, Nightfox wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    I've heard of newer standards such as Super Audio CD and Audio DVD,
    which I believe offer higher sample rates (and surround sound), but I don't think those caught on. I haven't seen very many music discs in those formats.

    Yeah, neither have I, but it's something you could introduce over time, because players have a limited life (since their lasers have a limited lifespan).


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Digital Man on Thursday, June 14, 2018 19:09:00
    On 06-13-18 12:21, Digital Man wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    Right, and 44.1kHz was supposed to allow for accurate reproduction of
    wave forms up to 22kHz (the .1 added to accommodate anti-aliasing
    filters) - or 44.1 was chosen for compatibility with existing video equipment (depending on who you listen to).

    Actially, the spec would have been for accurate reproduction only to 20 kHz. You would need the 2.1 kHz at those frequencies to get enough attenuation in the skirt with not too horrible phase properties in the passband.

    Larger (e.g. 24-bit) samples would have helped too. 24-bit 48kHz
    samples might (?) produce a more accurate analog waveform than 16-bit
    at 96kHz.

    24 bit would have been better, though 16 bit with dithering gives around 96dB dynamic range, far better than any analog media. I think the sample rate was the biggest constraint.

    DVD-Audio had promise, but it came about around the same time as
    mass-MP3 popularity (and iPods, iTunes, etc.) and the advancements in quantity (and portability) that the compressed file format/delivery technology provided beat out the advancements in quality that DVD-Audio offered.

    Compressed formats do offer more content for the space (multiple channels, multiple languages, etc), at the expense of reduced quality.

    I've long stated that if the music industry would improve their product over the technology of the 60's, that would (have) helped combat
    piracy. But as bandwidths and storage formats improved, the mainstream music storage/delivery format did not and it became easier to pirate. I think iTunes (and the like) made streaming and (legal) downloading ubiquitous, and the observable quality was at least "good enough" for
    the masses, so there's been no widespread demand for improvement in the best available formats available. And now that 4K movies can be widely/easily pirated, that argument (improvement in quality of content for anti-piracy means) is over.

    High quality is now a nice market, unfortunately. It would be nice for it to be more readily available.

    Neil Young pushed HDCD for a time and a lot of bands now release their music in high-rez (e.g. 24/96) digital download formats, but so much
    more could be done: - more audio channels (e.g. for surround sound or re-mixing/karaoke/play-along) - commentary tracks (like
    director's/actor's commentary on movies) - synced lyrics
    - synced images (album art or whatever)

    Bands and record companies have toyed with some of these things, but
    they should (in my view) become the "norm", or I wished so. :-)

    Yes, it would be better to have gone this way. I don't have the same time, nor the money to indulge in high end audio. :(


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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to MRO on Thursday, June 14, 2018 09:39:15
    Re: Re: Media
    By: MRO to Nightfox on Wed Jun 13 2018 07:05 pm

    i'm not a fan of surround sound. it's too distracting.
    we have had a 5.1 and now we just have a soundbar with two speakers.

    I'm surprised when I hear of things that make movies more realistic/life-like being "too distracting". I've heard the same argument for 3D movies as well.. We see in 3D, and we can percieve sound from all directions. It's just part of how we perceive things. I'm not sure how it could be too distracting..

    Nightfox

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Digital Man on Thursday, June 14, 2018 09:40:31
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Digital Man to Nightfox on Wed Jun 13 2018 08:37 pm

    Sound bars (no matter the number of speakers) usually provide some sort of "virtual" surround sound using DSPs that manipulate the audio to "fool" the human listener into hearing sounds from directions they're not physically coming from. https://www.howtogeek.com/336009/how-do-surround-sound-bars-work/

    Like the article says, they're better than the speakers built-into TVs (usually), but not as good as a true surround sound (e.g. 5.1) system.

    I've heard of ways to get virtual surround sound from 2 speakers. I didn't realize that was a design of sound bars though.. We only got the sound bar for the higher volume, as some movies & things we watch tend to be fairly low volume.

    Nightfox

    ---
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Digital Man on Thursday, June 14, 2018 09:48:49
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Digital Man to MRO on Wed Jun 13 2018 08:43 pm

    The kids and wife don't mind watching their shows or movies on tablets and phones, but I prefer to recline in front of a big screen and get the move-theater-level sound. So much better (for me).

    Years ago I bought a 4.1 speaker system for my computer, but I found that the 2 rear speakers often would be in the way as I was getting into/out of my computer chair, and when walking by, and the speakers could be easily knocked over. Perhaps it was due to the limited space where I had them set up.. Since then I've always been concerned about having extra cables/wires on the floor that could be tripped over and finding space for extra speakers. It almost seems like more hassle than it's worth, whether it be a computer sound system or a TV sound system.

    Nightfox

    ---
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  • From Digital Man@VERT to Vk3jed on Thursday, June 14, 2018 13:46:42
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Thu Jun 14 2018 06:59 pm

    On 06-13-18 09:22, Nightfox wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    I've heard of newer standards such as Super Audio CD and Audio DVD, which I believe offer higher sample rates (and surround sound), but I don't think those caught on. I haven't seen very many music discs in those formats.

    Yeah, neither have I, but it's something you could introduce over time, because players have a limited life (since their lasers have a limited lifespan).

    I think most people use solid-state players these days. When I ask my parents where their CD or DVD player is, their response: "People still use those?" :-)

    digital man

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  • From Digital Man@VERT to Nightfox on Thursday, June 14, 2018 13:51:55
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to Digital Man on Thu Jun 14 2018 09:48 am

    Re: Re: Media
    By: Digital Man to MRO on Wed Jun 13 2018 08:43 pm

    The kids and wife don't mind watching their shows or movies on tablets and phones, but I prefer to recline in front of a big screen and get the move-theater-level sound. So much better (for me).

    Years ago I bought a 4.1 speaker system for my computer, but I found that the 2 rear speakers often would be in the way as I was getting into/out of my computer chair, and when walking by, and the speakers could be easily knocked over. Perhaps it was due to the limited space where I had them set up.. Since then I've always been concerned about having extra cables/wires on the floor that could be tripped over and finding space for extra speakers. It almost seems like more hassle than it's worth, whether it be a computer sound system or a TV sound system.

    The surround speakers don't need to be large (though it does help if you have a larger sub-woofer) and they have wireless systems now too if wires are the main concern (you still have to supply power though).

    We watch a lot of cinematic video at home and the hassle is worth the results, for me. I mean, who has a 108" screen without surround sound? That's crazy! :-)

    digital man

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Digital Man on Thursday, June 14, 2018 16:04:23
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Digital Man to Vk3jed on Thu Jun 14 2018 01:46 pm

    I think most people use solid-state players these days. When I ask my parents where their CD or DVD player is, their response: "People still use those?" :-)

    I think one of the issues with solid-state players is that it can be more of a hassle to get media on them. That might or might not be an issue, depending on how savvy the user is. If you have a CD or a DVD, it's a fairly simple thing to put the disc in the player and play it. But with a solid-state player, media might or might not be readily available for purchase as a file that you can put on it. Movies are probably the best example: Not all movies are available as a file that you could just download and copy to the device. Often you'd have to rip the movie from the DVD/blu-ray (and there are multiple ways to do that), and then copy the file to the device. Usually, they find a way to make things fairly simple, but at least for movies, I still don't think they've simplified the process enough for a solid-state player (or movie server). It would be nice if you could buy movies on a USB drive that you could copy to your devices, or if all movies were available to buy as digital downloads that you could then store on your devices. Same with music: If all music were available to purchase on a USB drive or via digital download, I think it would be easier. Some music is available to purchase as a digital download, but not all..

    Nightfox

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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Digital Man on Thursday, June 14, 2018 21:08:40
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Digital Man to Nightfox on Wed Jun 13 2018 08:37 pm

    coming from. https://www.howtogeek.com/336009/how-do-surround-sound-bars-work/

    Like the article says, they're better than the speakers built-into TVs (usually), but not as good as a true surround sound (e.g. 5.1) system.


    i've just never been impressed by them. i've had some friends that really went all out. one even had speakers on poles hanging from the ceiling that i kept walking into.

    i'm looking at the tv so i want the sound to come out of the tv.
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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Digital Man on Thursday, June 14, 2018 21:11:30
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Digital Man to MRO on Wed Jun 13 2018 08:43 pm

    i'm not a fan of surround sound. it's too distracting.

    What about when you're in a theater? Do you find it distracting then? It might just be that you had your signal levels imblanaced (e.g. too loud in the rear channels).


    well, you might have a point there. my gf does play around with the channels all the time.

    i only go to the theater a few times a year because i always end up setting next to someone coughing all the time or playing on their phone the entire time. the sound seems okay to me in theaters.

    it could just be the accoustics in our living room, too.
    we have a large fishtank on one wall, and a lot of furnature scattered about. ---
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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Nightfox on Thursday, June 14, 2018 21:12:40
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to MRO on Thu Jun 14 2018 09:39 am

    Re: Re: Media
    By: MRO to Nightfox on Wed Jun 13 2018 07:05 pm

    i'm not a fan of surround sound. it's too distracting.
    we have had a 5.1 and now we just have a soundbar with two speakers.

    I'm surprised when I hear of things that make movies more realistic/life-like being "too distracting". I've heard the same argument for 3D movies as well.. We see in 3D, and we can percieve sound from all directions. It's just part of how we perceive things. I'm not sure how it could be too distracting..



    it probably pertains to how i focus in on sound and visual stimulation.

    but i'm not a fan of 3d. just seems like a fad and it's not close to the real world.
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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Nightfox on Thursday, June 14, 2018 21:13:29
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to Digital Man on Thu Jun 14 2018 09:48 am

    Re: Re: Media
    By: Digital Man to MRO on Wed Jun 13 2018 08:43 pm

    The kids and wife don't mind watching their shows or movies on tablets and phones, but I prefer to recline in front of a big screen and get the move-theater-level sound. So much better (for me).

    Years ago I bought a 4.1 speaker system for my computer, but I found that the 2 rear speakers often would be in the way as I was getting into/out of my computer chair, and when walking by, and the speakers could be easily knocked over. Perhaps it was due to the limited space where I had them set up.. Since then I've always been concerned about having extra cables/wires on the floor that could be tripped over and finding space for extra speakers. It almost seems like more hassle than it's worth, whether it be a computer sound system or a TV sound system.



    if you live in a house you can string the wires up from the basement. that's what we did
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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Friday, June 15, 2018 06:41:00
    On 06-14-18 09:39, Nightfox wrote to MRO <=-

    I'm surprised when I hear of things that make movies more realistic/life-like being "too distracting". I've heard the same
    argument for 3D movies as well.. We see in 3D, and we can percieve
    sound from all directions. It's just part of how we perceive things.
    I'm not sure how it could be too distracting..

    I like surrpund sound. Not only does it make movies sound more realistic, but when setup properly, it helps with getting details out there, things become easier to follow, sound wise. Not sure how 3D in home movies is going to go. I've tried it at the cinema and like it, but the home environment is quite different, with more distractions, etc.


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  • From Chai@VERT/ECBBS to MRO on Thursday, June 14, 2018 23:48:00
    MRO wrote to Nightfox <=-

    it probably pertains to how i focus in on sound and visual stimulation.

    but i'm not a fan of 3d. just seems like a fad and it's not close to
    the real world.


    I think VR has more potential than 3D, and even that has its limitations due to cost.
    I would, however, like to watch a full length horror film in VR, where you have a choice about what to look at in your virtual surroundings. It makes you feel like you're really there.

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  • From Ed Vance@VERT/CAPCITY2 to Nightfox on Thursday, June 14, 2018 23:14:00
    06-14-18 09:39 Nightfox wrote to MRO about Re: Media
    Howdy! Nightfox,

    @VIA: VERT/DIGDIST
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    Re: Re: Media
    By: MRO to Nightfox on Wed Jun 13 2018 07:05 pm

    i'm not a fan of surround sound. it's too distracting.
    we have had a 5.1 and now we just have a soundbar with two speakers.

    I'm surprised when I hear of things that make movies more realistic/life-like being "too distracting". I've heard the same
    argument for 3D movies as well.. We see in 3D, and we can percieve
    sound from all directions. It's just part of how we perceive things.
    I'm not sure how it could be too distracting..

    While I was watching the 70MM Todd-AO Movie "Oklahoma" at a Movie Theatre
    many, many, years ago there was one time a Speaker mounted on the back wall
    was used.

    Iirc, it was someone knocking on the Door and calling to the people in
    the house to let him in.

    Hearing that shocked me the first time I watched the movie.

    I suppose everyone in the audience turned their heads towards the back of
    the movie house when the Speaker came on.

    (Yes I paid for a Ticket to watch Oklahoma several times [5 or 6?]),
    I liked it that much.

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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Vk3jed on Friday, June 15, 2018 07:16:10
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Chai on Sun Jun 10 2018 08:22 am

    As for ebook DRM, I do remove DRM for archival purposes using Calibre - the Calibre repository has 2 purposes - backup, as well as format conversion for device compatibility. The "active" copies on devices are the original DRM'd ones.

    There's an interesting model - the "People are good" model. Cory Doctorow has all of this works available for download at craphound.com, and has allowed people to make their own translations and e-book format conversions available.

    Download them, and if you like them, buy the book. I've done so several times.

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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Nightfox on Friday, June 15, 2018 07:17:25
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to Chai on Sun Jun 10 2018 12:24 pm

    I don't like fumbling with them either, but I still like to buy music on CD because it provides a lossless copy of the music. Usually I buy music on CD and then rip it to FLAC (lossless) for a backup and also convert it to MP3 for use in my car, cell phone, music server, etc. The CD also provides a sort of backup so that if I lose my music files, I could re-rip them again.

    Agreed. having a lossless backup in the cloud is a nice option, too. I worry about losing everything to a hardware failure, fire, or whoknowswhat.

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to MRO on Friday, June 15, 2018 09:54:39
    Re: Re: Media
    By: MRO to Nightfox on Thu Jun 14 2018 09:13 pm

    having extra cables/wires on the floor that could be tripped over and
    finding space for extra speakers. It almost seems like more hassle
    than it's worth, whether it be a computer sound system or a TV sound
    system.

    if you live in a house you can string the wires up from the basement. that's what we did

    Many houses in my area don't have basements, though I believe they at least have a crawlspace (which may or may not be easy to walk around in).

    Nightfox

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Vk3jed on Friday, June 15, 2018 09:57:57
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Fri Jun 15 2018 06:41 am

    become easier to follow, sound wise. Not sure how 3D in home movies is going to go. I've tried it at the cinema and like it, but the home environment is quite different, with more distractions, etc.

    In the US, it seems 3D in home movies already came and went. 3D TVs and movies were sold in the US for a little while, and not too long ago I noticed 3D movies and TVs aren't being sold in the US anymore. At least the movies - I was asking someone at a Best Buy here recently if they have any 3D TVs (I haven't seen them advertised in a while), and they said actually a lot of their TVs support 3D, but they just don't advertise that anymore. It seems the market for 3D movies at home has not proven successful enough in the US. I'm a bit disappointed, because I just bought a 3D TV less than 3 years ago and started buying some 3D movies, and now it seems they aren't being sold anymore. I bought a copy of Terminator 2 3D when it was made into 3D last year, but it was unavailable for the US, so I had to buy a UK copy and rip it & re-burn it to Blu-Ray to remove the region coding so I could play it in my blu-ray player.

    Nightfox

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to poindexter FORTRAN on Friday, June 15, 2018 10:41:10
    Re: Re: Media
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Nightfox on Fri Jun 15 2018 07:17 am

    I don't like fumbling with them either, but I still like to buy
    music on CD because it provides a lossless copy of the music.
    Usually I buy music on CD and then rip it to FLAC (lossless) for a
    backup and also convert it to MP3 for use in my car, cell phone,
    music server, etc. The CD also provides a sort of backup so that if
    I lose my music files, I could re-rip them again.

    Agreed. having a lossless backup in the cloud is a nice option, too. I worry about losing everything to a hardware failure, fire, or whoknowswhat.

    I'm not sure I feel comfortable having a backup in the cloud. I've always kept backups on external drives that I own. But I suppose there is a risk there in case of fire, theft, etc..

    Nightfox

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to MRO on Friday, June 15, 2018 10:45:38
    Re: Re: Media
    By: MRO to Digital Man on Thu Jun 14 2018 09:11 pm

    i only go to the theater a few times a year because i always end up setting next to someone coughing all the time or playing on their phone the entire time. the sound seems okay to me in theaters.

    Sounds like bad luck. I don't go to the theater very often anymore either though, mainly because ticket prices have gone up so much. Back in the day, theater ticket prices for afternoon times (before 5:00PM or so) was around $3.25 for a movie ticket. These days, when I go see a movie, it's usually at least $8 or so, or $10 or more for a premium screen/theater or 3D showing. With 2 people, that's at least $20, and more if you buy drinks and snacks at the theater. For that much, you could buy the movie and watch it at home, or pay a lot less to rent the movie and watch it at home.

    Nightfox

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Friday, June 15, 2018 10:48:34
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Chai to MRO on Thu Jun 14 2018 11:48 pm

    I think VR has more potential than 3D, and even that has its limitations due to cost.

    VR and 3D seem very similar to me. I'm not quite sure why things like 3D
    home movies would be a flop (in the US) when VR might succeed.

    Around 1995 or 1996, I remember seeing a demo for some 3D computer goggles at a store, and they had it set up with Descent (a popular PC game at the time). I think the goggles even let you look around with your head, like VR systems do today. I thought it was pretty cool, but it didn't take off at the time. So it seems interesting to me that they're making VR/3D for games again these days. I'm not sure if 3D gaming is taking off these days though, as I haven't been following the news in that area.

    Nightfox

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  • From Digital Man@VERT to Nightfox on Friday, June 15, 2018 12:17:34
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to Digital Man on Thu Jun 14 2018 04:04 pm

    Re: Re: Media
    By: Digital Man to Vk3jed on Thu Jun 14 2018 01:46 pm

    I think most people use solid-state players these days. When I ask my parents where their CD or DVD player is, their response: "People still use those?" :-)

    I think one of the issues with solid-state players is that it can be more of a hassle to get media on them.

    With all the streaming media services available, many consumers (e.g. my parents, kids) don't use stored media any more. And for the stuff they can't stream using mainstream services, I provide to them using Plex.

    I think the only players they store media on is their iPhones/iPads, and they barely do that.


    digital man

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Digital Man on Friday, June 15, 2018 14:24:00
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Digital Man to Nightfox on Fri Jun 15 2018 12:17 pm

    With all the streaming media services available, many consumers (e.g. my parents, kids) don't use stored media any more. And for the stuff they can't stream using mainstream services, I provide to them using Plex.

    I think the only players they store media on is their iPhones/iPads, and they barely do that.

    That's interesting to hear. I have a lot of music on CDs that I have purchased, and I have converted it all to MP3 to store on my devices so I can listen to it at any time. I also have a USB flash drive for my car that I've stored my music on so I can listen to it in my car easily. I still think stored media is the most reliable way to listen to music (and movies too). Especially in something like a car, where ceullar reception can be spotty as you drive, I think music kept on a media storage device is good to have. I also just like to be able to quickly play anything from my music library on my smartphone (or other device) without having to rely on a streaming service. Sometimes my internet service might go down or my router at home might drop wifi or something while I'm trying to stream.

    I do have my music library on my Plex server though, so I could stream it at home from there. One annoying thing, though, is that different devices don't all support Plex. At home I have a Logitech Squeezebox, which is a stand-alone internet radio streamer, which also supports streaming music from a server that you can set up on your network. But Logitech's media server is its own thing, so I have to run that alongside Plex (though the good thing is that I can point it to the same set of MP3s I use for Plex, so I don't have to waste drive space). I also have an Amazon Echo at home, but it looks like there isn't a Plex "skill" for the Echo that can connect to my Plex library. There is a Plex skill for the Echo, but last time I checked, all that does is allow you to control Plex on your TV from your Amazon Echo.

    Nightfox

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Digital Man on Friday, June 15, 2018 14:25:59
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Digital Man to Nightfox on Fri Jun 15 2018 12:17 pm

    With all the streaming media services available, many consumers (e.g. my parents, kids) don't use stored media any more. And for the stuff they

    Also - When I was a kid, one of my favorite things I got for Christmas one year was a Walkman that could play cassette tapes. I was excited to be able to listen to my favorite music with headphones and not bother people, and to be able to do that while on road trips with the family. It's interesting to think that stored media isn't as important to many people as it used to be.

    Nightfox

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  • From Chai@VERT/ECBBS to Nightfox on Friday, June 15, 2018 19:04:00
    Nightfox wrote to Chai <=-

    Re: Re: Media
    By: Chai to MRO on Thu Jun 14 2018 11:48 pm

    VR and 3D seem very similar to me. I'm not quite sure why things like
    3D home movies would be a flop (in the US) when VR might succeed.

    I think mostly because of what they plan on doing with VR. 3D is nice, but it isn't interactive. In short, you can get bored with it easily.

    it didn't take off at the time. So it seems interesting to me that they're making VR/3D for games again these days. I'm not sure if 3D gaming is taking off these days though, as I haven't been following the news in that area.

    I think the technology we have now will allow us to do cooler things with it, compared to what we could do in the 90's. I thought the same thing as you initially, but I'm starting to see a future in the technology. I've been wrong many times before, though. Time will tell.

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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Digital Man on Saturday, June 16, 2018 09:03:00
    On 06-14-18 13:46, Digital Man wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    I think most people use solid-state players these days. When I ask my parents where their CD or DVD player is, their response: "People still
    use those?" :-)

    Yeah, and it should be easier to introduce new formats these days, with cheaper, more versatile hardware, and an increasing trend towards software definition of operating modes.


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to poindexter FORTRAN on Saturday, June 16, 2018 09:06:00
    On 06-15-18 07:16, poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    There's an interesting model - the "People are good" model. Cory
    Doctorow has all of this works available for download at craphound.com, and has allowed people to make their own translations and e-book format conversions available.

    Download them, and if you like them, buy the book. I've done so several times.

    Cool I've seen this in the software world too, with VBAudio Cable (virtual audio cable driver) and VoiceMeeter/Voicemeeter Banana (advanced Windows mixer software). You can download and use these programs. If you find them useful, a donation is requested (you decide the amount).


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Saturday, June 16, 2018 09:08:00
    On 06-15-18 09:57, Nightfox wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    In the US, it seems 3D in home movies already came and went. 3D TVs

    I think the same happened here. Don't hear anything about 3D these days. Out TV is 3D, but we've never had a 3D Blu-ray player, so 3D mode has never been used.


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Chai on Saturday, June 16, 2018 10:10:00
    On 06-14-18 23:48, Chai wrote to MRO <=-

    I think VR has more potential than 3D, and even that has its
    limitations due to cost.

    VR could become rather intrusive and isolating though for movies, but for gaming, I see a lot more promise. My only real experience with VR was in a prototype training simulator, where I was presented with some realistic firefighting scenarios (though the simulation didn't quite agree with my internal physics models - I am very detailed in that regard!). Probably the only way I'll ever get to fight an engine fire on a Boeing 737 on the tarmac. :) This simulator included realistic water jet reaction, so you could feel the hose kick when you opened it up.


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Saturday, June 16, 2018 10:12:00
    On 06-15-18 09:54, Nightfox wrote to MRO <=-

    Many houses in my area don't have basements, though I believe they at least have a crawlspace (which may or may not be easy to walk around
    in).

    Basements are very rare here. Olfer houses may have a crawl space. Newer houses tend to be built on concrete slabs, though smart builders will get wiring built in. :)


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Saturday, June 16, 2018 10:43:00
    On 06-15-18 14:24, Nightfox wrote to Digital Man <=-

    That's interesting to hear. I have a lot of music on CDs that I have purchased, and I have converted it all to MP3 to store on my devices so
    I can listen to it at any time. I also have a USB flash drive for my
    car that I've stored my music on so I can listen to it in my car
    easily. I still think stored media is the most reliable way to listen
    to music (and movies too). Especially in something like a car, where ceullar reception can be spotty as you drive, I think music kept on a media storage device is good to have. I also just like to be able to quickly play anything from my music library on my smartphone (or other device) without having to rely on a streaming service. Sometimes my internet service might go down or my router at home might drop wifi or something while I'm trying to stream.

    I'm with you. I like to have locally stored music. Streming is fine for radio broadcasts (I listen to more streaming radio of actual stations than I do off air these days), or when I want to try something different that I haven't got, but for mobile and portable use, nothing beats having locally stored media files. That's easier, more efficient, more reliable (no drop outs!), and saves battery life and mobile data.

    I do have my music library on my Plex server though, so I could stream
    it at home from there. One annoying thing, though, is that different devices don't all support Plex. At home I have a Logitech Squeezebox, which is a stand-alone internet radio streamer, which also supports streaming music from a server that you can set up on your network. But Logitech's media server is its own thing, so I have to run that
    alongside Plex (though the good thing is that I can point it to the
    same set of MP3s I use for Plex, so I don't have to waste drive space).
    I also have an Amazon Echo at home, but it looks like there isn't a
    Plex "skill" for the Echo that can connect to my Plex library. There is
    a Plex skill for the Echo, but last time I checked, all that does is
    allow you to control Plex on your TV from your Amazon Echo.

    I've thought about using Plex, but the overheads to convert, copy and store our media lbrary are quite prohibitive - I dunno how many TB we'd require! Certainly in multiple drive territory.


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Saturday, June 16, 2018 10:44:00
    On 06-15-18 14:25, Nightfox wrote to Digital Man <=-

    Also - When I was a kid, one of my favorite things I got for Christmas
    one year was a Walkman that could play cassette tapes. I was excited
    to be able to listen to my favorite music with headphones and not
    bother people, and to be able to do that while on road trips with the family. It's interesting to think that stored media isn't as important
    to many people as it used to be.

    Still is to me, for mobile and portable use. It's too easy to drive into a 3G/4G black hole out here, and *BOOM*, there goes the streaming. :)


    ... Massachusetts has the best politicians money can buy.
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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Chai on Saturday, June 16, 2018 11:15:18
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Chai to MRO on Thu Jun 14 2018 11:48 pm

    to cost.
    I would, however, like to watch a full length horror film in VR, where you have a choice about what to look at in your virtual surroundings. It makes you feel like you're really there.


    now that sounds interesting. better than going around and picking up balls
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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to poindexter FORTRAN on Saturday, June 16, 2018 11:16:22
    Re: Re: Media
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Vk3jed on Fri Jun 15 2018 07:16 am

    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Chai on Sun Jun 10 2018 08:22 am

    As for ebook DRM, I do remove DRM for archival purposes using Calibre - the Calibre repository has 2 purposes - backup, as well as format conversion for device compatibility. The "active" copies on devices are the original DRM'd ones.



    studies have shown that the people who 'steal' music the most are also the ones that purchase it the most.
    ---
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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Nightfox on Saturday, June 16, 2018 11:18:23
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to Digital Man on Fri Jun 15 2018 02:25 pm

    Re: Re: Media
    By: Digital Man to Nightfox on Fri Jun 15 2018 12:17 pm

    With all the streaming media services available, many consumers (e.g. my parents, kids) don't use stored media any more. And for the stuff they

    Also - When I was a kid, one of my favorite things I got for Christmas one year was a Walkman that could play cassette tapes. I was excited to be able to listen to my favorite music with headphones and not bother people, and to be able to do that while on road trips with the family. It's interesting to think that stored media isn't as important to many people as it used to be.

    Nightfox



    yeah, me too. i loved that walkman. it made me so happy to have it. when you get old those feelings dont exist anymore.
    ---
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  • From Hawkeye@VERT/MASHBBS to MRO on Saturday, June 16, 2018 19:41:35
    Re: Re: Media
    By: MRO to Nightfox on Thu Jun 14 2018 21:12:40

    I'm surprised when I hear of things that make movies more realistic/life-like being "too distracting". I've heard the same argument for 3D movies as well.. We see in 3D, and we can percieve sound from all directions. It's just part of how we perceive things. I'm not sure how it could be too distracting..

    New tech always bring in people who like it and dislike it, not always based on facts... color tv was weird, faxmachines also.. etc... why would I like to pause a video was something I heart in the 80s when my parents had a VCR.

    HAWKEYE

    - MASH BBS - mash4077.ddns.net - The Netherlands -

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ MASH4077.DDNS.NET - MASH BBS - The Netherlands
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Saturday, June 16, 2018 20:11:31
    Re: VR
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Fri Jun 15 2018 07:04 pm

    I think mostly because of what they plan on doing with VR. 3D is nice, but it isn't interactive. In short, you can get bored with it easily.

    Yeah, but I suppose the same argument could be made for movies.. Movies aren't interactive, but people still enjoy watching them.

    I think the technology we have now will allow us to do cooler things with it, compared to what we could do in the 90's. I thought the same thing as you initially, but I'm starting to see a future in the technology. I've been wrong many times before, though. Time will tell.

    I actually thought 3D for gaming was pretty cool when I saw the demo in the 90s. I didn't know why it didn't take off at the time.

    Nightfox

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Vk3jed on Saturday, June 16, 2018 20:13:08
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Sat Jun 16 2018 09:08 am

    In the US, it seems 3D in home movies already came and went. 3D TVs

    I think the same happened here. Don't hear anything about 3D these days. Out TV is 3D, but we've never had a 3D Blu-ray player, so 3D mode has never been used.

    Do you mean 3D blu-ray players have never been available where you are, or you just never bought one? If you're still interested in buying one but can't find them at your local stores, you could probably buy one online. You may have to buy a region-free player if ones aren't available in your area to ensure you can play discs you buy.

    Nightfox

    ---
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Vk3jed on Saturday, June 16, 2018 20:15:14
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Sat Jun 16 2018 10:43 am

    I've thought about using Plex, but the overheads to convert, copy and store our media lbrary are quite prohibitive - I dunno how many TB we'd require! Certainly in multiple drive territory.

    If you compress the movies, it shouldn't be too terribly bad. A blu-ray movie compressed (as a .mp4 or .mkv etc.) could take up between 1GB and 3GB, depending on the quality settings you use. Most of my blu-ray movies I've ripped are between 1GB and 2GB.

    Nightfox

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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Nightfox on Saturday, June 16, 2018 23:29:57
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to Vk3jed on Sat Jun 16 2018 08:15 pm

    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Sat Jun 16 2018 10:43 am

    I've thought about using Plex, but the overheads to convert, copy and store our media lbrary are quite prohibitive - I dunno how many TB we'd require! Certainly in multiple drive territory.

    If you compress the movies, it shouldn't be too terribly bad. A blu-ray movie compressed (as a .mp4 or .mkv etc.) could take up between 1GB and 3GB, depending on the quality settings you use. Most of my blu-ray movies I've ripped are between 1GB and 2GB.



    you have to use the correct compression method and software. also mkv is just a container file and can use different codecs and it can contain subtitles.
    i wouldnt want to watch a bluray that was less than 4gb
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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Sunday, June 17, 2018 16:05:00
    On 06-16-18 20:13, Nightfox wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    Do you mean 3D blu-ray players have never been available where you are,
    or you just never bought one? If you're still interested in buying one

    Never got around to buying one. Got a perfectly good player, not sure if there's any 3D movies in the collection anyway. :)

    but can't find them at your local stores, you could probably buy one online. You may have to buy a region-free player if ones aren't
    available in your area to ensure you can play discs you buy.

    There was a period where the shops would quietly give you the region free cracks for the players they sold on a piece of paper. :)


    ... It is better to know some of the questions than all of the answers.
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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Sunday, June 17, 2018 16:07:00
    On 06-16-18 20:15, Nightfox wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    @VIA: VERT/DIGDIST
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Sat Jun 16 2018 10:43 am

    I've thought about using Plex, but the overheads to convert, copy and store our media lbrary are quite prohibitive - I dunno how many TB we'd require! Certainly in multiple drive territory.

    If you compress the movies, it shouldn't be too terribly bad. A
    blu-ray movie compressed (as a .mp4 or .mkv etc.) could take up between 1GB and 3GB, depending on the quality settings you use. Most of my blu-ray movies I've ripped are between 1GB and 2GB.


    Well, when we first met, we had an estimated 4000 titles. Today, it's many times that. :) Of course, simply moving that amount of data, even though much of it is already in media files, is a massive job in itself. An attempt was made to catalogue it around 10 years ago, but was given up as "impossible to keep up". :D


    ... Dew knot trussed yore spell chequer two fined awl mistakes!
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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to MRO on Sunday, June 17, 2018 16:29:00
    On 06-16-18 11:16, MRO wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    studies have shown that the people who 'steal' music the most are also
    the ones that purchase it the most.

    I'm not surprised, they're music lovers and will get it however they can.


    ... You're the reason my dog is pregnant, aren't you?
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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Sunday, June 17, 2018 16:34:00
    On 06-16-18 20:11, Nightfox wrote to Chai <=-

    Yeah, but I suppose the same argument could be made for movies..
    Movies aren't interactive, but people still enjoy watching them.

    Yes, one difference is in 2D, you're not immersed in a 3D setup, so you can do other things while watching the movie (like writing BBS mail ;) ). When immersed in a 3D or VR environment (goggles/glasses/etc), it's harder to do anything else on the side, or communicate with others in the same room. In a gaming scenario, you can at least interact via the game.


    ... A skydiving school is one in which you MUST be a dropout to graduate.
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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Chai on Saturday, June 16, 2018 22:04:00
    Chai wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    My Toyota didn't come with any of that, but I've had it awhile. I
    could always put in a new stereo, though. Maybe, during the Christmas season. It would be worth it for the voice command.


    There are some nice, cheap Android head units that fit into a double-DIN
    slot; I'm tempted to get one myself. The Prius electronics are dated at
    best, and use a DVD-based GPS system, which is a pain when roads change.



    ... Would you like to wake up from this dream?
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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Vk3jed on Sunday, June 17, 2018 15:00:55
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to MRO on Sun Jun 17 2018 04:29 pm

    On 06-16-18 11:16, MRO wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    studies have shown that the people who 'steal' music the most are also the ones that purchase it the most.

    I'm not surprised, they're music lovers and will get it however they can.



    they are probably trying before they buy. and they keep the cds and dvds in the cases. they did this study in canada years ago
    ---
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Vk3jed on Sunday, June 17, 2018 15:32:57
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Sun Jun 17 2018 04:05 pm

    There was a period where the shops would quietly give you the region free cracks for the players they sold on a piece of paper. :)

    I've read that for my blu-ray player, there is a region-free code for it but that only works for DVDs, not blu-ray discs.

    Nightfox

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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to MRO on Monday, June 18, 2018 08:20:00
    On 06-17-18 15:00, MRO wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    they are probably trying before they buy. and they keep the cds and
    dvds in the cases. they did this study in canada years ago

    Yeah, done the same with movies before.


    ... You know. That old guy who carried moderation to excess.
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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Monday, June 18, 2018 12:27:00
    On 06-17-18 15:32, Nightfox wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    I've read that for my blu-ray player, there is a region-free code for
    it but that only works for DVDs, not blu-ray discs.

    Hmm, OK. interesting. I think mine is universal.


    ... Health is merely the slowest possible rate at which one can die.
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Vk3jed on Monday, June 18, 2018 09:28:00
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Sat Jun 16 2018 10:44 am

    road trips with the family. It's interesting to think that stored
    media isn't as important to many people as it used to be.

    Still is to me, for mobile and portable use. It's too easy to drive into a 3G/4G black hole out here, and *BOOM*, there goes the streaming. :)

    I agree. I think cellular connections would have to become a lot more reliable for me to want to use streaming in the car. There's also satellite car radio (such as Sirius, and formerlly XM radio). I subscribed to that for a short time but actually didn't use it much, so I stopped subscribing to it. When I bought my current car, I found that my car would have came with a satellite radio tuner as standard, and I asked them to remove it, which took about $300 off the price of the car.

    Nightfox

    ---
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Hawkeye on Monday, June 18, 2018 09:33:05
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Hawkeye to MRO on Sat Jun 16 2018 07:41 pm

    I'm surprised when I hear of things that make movies more
    realistic/life-like being "too distracting". I've heard the same
    argument for 3D movies as well.. We see in 3D, and we can percieve
    sound from all directions. It's just part of how we perceive
    things. I'm not sure how it could be too distracting..

    This was my message that you quoted, but you were replying to Mro..

    New tech always bring in people who like it and dislike it, not always based on facts... color tv was weird, faxmachines also.. etc... why would I like to pause a video was something I heart in the 80s when my parents had a VCR.

    Yeah, there are often comments like that when new things come out. When Apple's iPhone came out (it was the first smartphone on the market), I thought it seemed overkill for a phone and I didn't know why I'd want one.. I wanted a cell phone mainly for a phone to be able to talk to people while I'm away from home. But after a while I saw the usefullness in those, and I've had a smartphone now since 2011.

    Nightfox

    ---
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to poindexter FORTRAN on Monday, June 18, 2018 09:35:07
    Re: Re: Media
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Chai on Sat Jun 16 2018 10:04 pm

    There are some nice, cheap Android head units that fit into a double-DIN slot; I'm tempted to get one myself. The Prius electronics are dated at best, and use a DVD-based GPS system, which is a pain when roads change.

    I've heard of Android Auto - Is that something different? Apple also has something called Apple CarPlay.

    Nightfox

    ---
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  • From Hawkeye@VERT/MASHBBS to Vk3jed on Monday, June 18, 2018 13:46:47
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to MRO on Mon Jun 18 2018 08:20:00

    Yeah, done the same with movies before.

    I even do it now. I'm a fan of Red Dwarf but it is not available on TV in The Netherlands. I download all episodes but I buy now and then some merchandise so I still support the franchise.

    HAWKEYE

    - MASH BBS - mash4077.ddns.net - The Netherlands -

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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Nightfox on Monday, June 18, 2018 10:48:13
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to poindexter FORTRAN on Mon Jun 18 2018 09:35 am

    I've heard of Android Auto - Is that something different? Apple also has something called Apple CarPlay.

    I was referring to an Android tablet that fits into a double-DIN slot.

    ---
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to poindexter FORTRAN on Monday, June 18, 2018 12:54:27
    Re: Re: Media
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Nightfox on Mon Jun 18 2018 10:48 am

    I've heard of Android Auto - Is that something different? Apple also
    has something called Apple CarPlay.

    I was referring to an Android tablet that fits into a double-DIN slot.

    Yes, I wasn't sure if that's what Android Auto is or if Android Auto is something different.

    Nightfox

    ---
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Vk3jed on Monday, June 18, 2018 13:00:03
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Sun Jun 17 2018 04:07 pm

    Well, when we first met, we had an estimated 4000 titles. Today, it's many times that. :) Of course, simply moving that amount of data, even though

    That's definitely a lot of movies. I'm not sure if there are that many movies that I'd consider are worth watching. :) I've never been much of a collector of things, though I do have a modest collection of movies on blu-ray and DVD. I'd estimate I may have around 100 movies tops. I used to have some more on DVD that I sold years ago. Usually I'll buy a movie or TV series if I like it a lot (and if I haven't seen it, if I'm pretty sure I'd like it). I don't often watch movies multiple times, so if I buy a movie, it might just end up sitting on the shelf in the case, making it basically a waste of money.

    Even if I start watching one of my favorite movies again, sometimes I'll feel like I want to go do something else because I've already seen the movie before.

    Nightfox

    ---
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  • From Digital Man@VERT to Nightfox on Monday, June 18, 2018 13:17:46
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to Hawkeye on Mon Jun 18 2018 09:33 am

    Yeah, there are often comments like that when new things come out. When Apple's iPhone came out (it was the first smartphone on the market), I

    Are you sure about that (iPhone being the "first smartphone")?

    I had a blackberry before the iPhone came out and I'm pretty sure it was considered a "smartphone".

    digital man

    This Is Spinal Tap quote #14:
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Digital Man on Monday, June 18, 2018 14:02:00
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Digital Man to Nightfox on Mon Jun 18 2018 01:17 pm

    Yeah, there are often comments like that when new things come out.
    When Apple's iPhone came out (it was the first smartphone on the
    market), I

    Are you sure about that (iPhone being the "first smartphone")?

    I had a blackberry before the iPhone came out and I'm pretty sure it was considered a "smartphone".

    I suppose a Blackberry could be considered a smartphone. I don't remember hearing people call them that, but I suppose it makes sense. I never used a Blackberry device, so I'm not sure what exactly their capabilities were. I thought the iPhone was the first of a new type of form factor for a phone, with its touch screen and its set of internet apps (web browser, email client, etc.) and the ability to install other apps easily, etc.

    Nightfox

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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Nightfox on Monday, June 18, 2018 14:48:12
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to poindexter FORTRAN on Mon Jun 18 2018 12:54 pm

    Yes, I wasn't sure if that's what Android Auto is or if Android Auto is something different.

    Android Auto mirrors selected apps from your phone on the car unit, and requires a phone to work.

    ---
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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Tuesday, June 19, 2018 09:07:00
    On 06-18-18 09:28, Nightfox wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    I agree. I think cellular connections would have to become a lot more reliable for me to want to use streaming in the car. There's also

    All you have to do here is go north and turn off the highways and you're out of coverage. And from here that can happen within 10 minutes. Usually, there's a cell in every town, but I know one town you can't get reliable reception. Pretty handy for the local gliding club - NOT!

    satellite car radio (such as Sirius, and formerlly XM radio). I

    Not here there isn't, someone put a planet in the way ;) (mutters "bloody Americans, think they're the only people on Earth" :D )

    Never mind my stirring. :D


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Hawkeye on Tuesday, June 19, 2018 09:10:00
    On 06-18-18 13:46, Hawkeye wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    Yeah, done the same with movies before.

    I even do it now. I'm a fan of Red Dwarf but it is not available on TV
    in The Netherlands. I download all episodes but I buy now and then some merchandise so I still support the franchise.

    One wonders why the piracy here in Australia is so high. It's for this reason, there's a lot we either don't get, or get months or years later than the rest of the world. The networks are slowly waking up, and big ticket series are "Fast tracked", meaning they air here within 24 hours of their original airing.
    Shows like Dr Who do this, as did Game of Thrones (after they realised fans here were downloading it simply to keep up with their US friends).


    ... It is not enough to succeed. Others must fail.
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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Tuesday, June 19, 2018 09:20:00
    On 06-18-18 13:00, Nightfox wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    That's definitely a lot of movies. I'm not sure if there are that many movies that I'd consider are worth watching. :) I've never been much

    There is a lot out there, especially if you include non English speaking titles and niche movies.

    of a collector of things, though I do have a modest collection of
    movies on blu-ray and DVD. I'd estimate I may have around 100 movies
    tops. I used to have some more on DVD that I sold years ago. Usually I'll buy a movie or TV series if I like it a lot (and if I haven't seen it, if I'm pretty sure I'd like it). I don't often watch movies
    multiple times, so if I buy a movie, it might just end up sitting on
    the shelf in the case, making it basically a waste of money.

    TV series on DVD or Blu-ray here are a "post broadcast" thing, so you need to be able to watch it initially off air. Or these days, more likely off Netflix for anything decent. :)

    Even if I start watching one of my favorite movies again, sometimes
    I'll feel like I want to go do something else because I've already seen the movie before.

    I find I pick up more in subsequent viewings. :)


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Tuesday, June 19, 2018 09:28:00
    On 06-18-18 09:33, Nightfox wrote to Hawkeye <=-

    Yeah, there are often comments like that when new things come out.
    When Apple's iPhone came out (it was the first smartphone on the
    market), I thought it seemed overkill for a phone and I didn't know why I'd want one.. I wanted a cell phone mainly for a phone to be able to talk to people while I'm away from home. But after a while I saw the usefullness in those, and I've had a smartphone now since 2011.

    I was the same like "Why would I spend $$$$$ on a .... phone!". But after I had seen other peoples' iPhones, I could see the benefits and bought one in 2009, then upgraded in 2011, but more recently, have switched to Android.


    ... Open mouth, insert foot, echo internationally.
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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Vk3jed on Tuesday, June 19, 2018 08:24:51
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Tue Jun 19 2018 09:07 am

    All you have to do here is go north and turn off the highways and you're out of coverage. And from here that can happen within 10 minutes. Usually, there's a cell in every town, but I know one town you can't get reliable reception.

    At home, we've been getting spottier and spottier cell coverage. I think AT&T is starting to sacrifice their traditional 4G bandwidth for VoLTE bandwidth. new AT&T customers with newer phones get the bandwidth, older phones and MVNOs like Cricket Wireless get what's left over.

    Wi-Fi callingis an option I'm looking into, don't know if it helps with inbound calling, too.

    As much as I hate AT&T, I loved when work paid for a microcell; I had 5 bars in the house.


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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Vk3jed on Tuesday, June 19, 2018 09:42:53
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Tue Jun 19 2018 09:20 am

    Even if I start watching one of my favorite movies again, sometimes
    I'll feel like I want to go do something else because I've already
    seen the movie before.

    I find I pick up more in subsequent viewings. :)

    Yeah, some movies are like that.

    Nightfox

    ---
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Vk3jed on Tuesday, June 19, 2018 09:48:31
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Tue Jun 19 2018 09:28 am

    I was the same like "Why would I spend $$$$$ on a .... phone!". But after I had seen other peoples' iPhones, I could see the benefits and bought one in 2009, then upgraded in 2011, but more recently, have switched to Android.

    I'm surprised that it seems that smartphone prices have gone up over the years. Usually, the prices for technology items goes down over time. I think I spent around $200 on my first smartphone - I know it wasn't the most high-end phone, but it didn't seem too bad. I later upgraded to a Samsung Galaxy phone and have bought a couple newer models of the Galaxy since then. But lately, as I've been looking at the prices for the latest Samsung Galaxy and iPhone models, it seems they keep getting more and more expensive. These days, you could pay around $800 to $1000 (US) for a new model of one of those phones.. Seems a bit steep. There are cellular plans that let you spread out that cost so that instead of paying for that up-front, you can pay maybe $20-$30 per month for the phone (on top of your phone bill), and they also let you upgrade every 2 years or so if you want. But that also means a fairly high cell phone bill (at least, higher than what I'm used to paying). There's one cell provider I was considering switching to, but I realized that in addition to the base bill cost, they also add some kind of phone "access fee", which is in addition to and separate from the cost of the phone.. For instance, if you don't buy the phone up front, you might pay around $20 per month for the price of the phone, plus an extra $20 or so for the phone "access fee" on top of the cell phone bill. Seemed pretty ridiculous.. Even if I bought the phone up front, I'd still probably be paying more per month with them than I'm paying now with my current provider.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Vk3jed on Tuesday, June 19, 2018 09:52:05
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Hawkeye on Tue Jun 19 2018 09:10 am

    One wonders why the piracy here in Australia is so high. It's for this reason, there's a lot we either don't get, or get months or years later than the rest of the world. The networks are slowly waking up, and big

    It frustrated me that Netflix was carrying the new Star Trek series (Discovery) in most of the world except the US.. In the US, we'd have to subscribe to CBS All Access (yet another streaming service) to watch it legally.

    Nightfox

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    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to poindexter FORTRAN on Tuesday, June 19, 2018 09:53:38
    Re: Re: Media
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Vk3jed on Tue Jun 19 2018 08:24 am

    Wi-Fi callingis an option I'm looking into, don't know if it helps with inbound calling, too.

    As much as I hate AT&T, I loved when work paid for a microcell; I had 5 bars in the house.

    Currently I'm using Virgin Mobile, which is more of a budget cell service. It works most of the time, though in some areas I don't get a good signal. And it seems that Virgin Mobile phones don't have wi-fi calling, and Virgin Mobile doesn't offer microcells either.

    Nightfox

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    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Nightfox on Tuesday, June 19, 2018 14:29:42
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to Vk3jed on Tue Jun 19 2018 09:52 am

    It frustrated me that Netflix was carrying the new Star Trek series (Discovery) in most of the world except the US.. In the US, we'd have to subscribe to CBS All Access (yet another streaming service) to watch it legally.

    Was? Curiously, Netflix usually blocks access from proxies. I'll need to try an overseas proxy and see what happens. :)

    ---
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to poindexter FORTRAN on Tuesday, June 19, 2018 15:23:11
    Re: Re: Media
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Nightfox on Tue Jun 19 2018 02:29 pm

    It frustrated me that Netflix was carrying the new Star Trek series
    (Discovery) in most of the world except the US.. In the US, we'd
    have to subscribe to CBS All Access (yet another streaming service)
    to watch it legally.

    Was? Curiously, Netflix usually blocks access from proxies. I'll need to try an overseas proxy and see what happens. :)

    I guess "is" would be better, as I assume they're still carrying it. Season 1 has already ended, which is why I was thinking "was".

    Nightfox

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    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to poindexter FORTRAN on Tuesday, June 19, 2018 15:25:19
    Re: Re: Media
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Nightfox on Tue Jun 19 2018 02:29 pm

    Was? Curiously, Netflix usually blocks access from proxies. I'll need to try an overseas proxy and see what happens. :)

    I've heard of people using a VPN to access Netflix content that isn't available in their region.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to poindexter FORTRAN on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 09:36:00
    On 06-19-18 08:24, poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    At home, we've been getting spottier and spottier cell coverage. I
    think AT&T is starting to sacrifice their traditional 4G bandwidth for VoLTE bandwidth. new AT&T customers with newer phones get the
    bandwidth, older phones and MVNOs like Cricket Wireless get what's left over.

    Coverage is still getting better here, but it's a case of so much area, so few people. :)

    Wi-Fi callingis an option I'm looking into, don't know if it helps with inbound calling, too.

    As far as I can tell, wifi calling is not supported here. I have a phone that will do it, but it won't enable, which suggests no carrier support.

    As much as I hate AT&T, I loved when work paid for a microcell; I had 5 bars in the house.

    :-)


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 09:37:00
    On 06-19-18 09:42, Nightfox wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    I find I pick up more in subsequent viewings. :)

    Yeah, some movies are like that.

    And some TV series too. :)


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 09:48:00
    On 06-19-18 09:48, Nightfox wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    I'm surprised that it seems that smartphone prices have gone up over
    the years. Usually, the prices for technology items goes down over

    Yes, good point, most tech does go down dramatically over the year - look at computers. Someone's gouging prices of smartphones. At least with Android, there some quite reasonably priced midrange phones on the market from the better Chinese manufacturers.

    time. I think I spent around $200 on my first smartphone - I know it wasn't the most high-end phone, but it didn't seem too bad. I later

    My first one was an iPhone 3GS, which I got with a plan. At the time, I was making a lot of calls for business purposes, and the plan was a good investment. Second one was an iPhone 4S, which I bought outright direct from Apple and which cost me $1k roughly. My chrrent phone is one of the abovementioned Chinese midrange phones, which cost $225, and performs reasonably well. It's got a few little niggles, and I'm hoping to replace it later this year. I also need a phone with a magnetometer (still has to be Android), to interface an app with the new magnetic "gates" build into the resurfaced track in town (only one outside Europe, from what I can tell!), for a performance monitoring app.

    upgraded to a Samsung Galaxy phone and have bought a couple newer
    models of the Galaxy since then. But lately, as I've been looking at
    the prices for the latest Samsung Galaxy and iPhone models, it seems
    they keep getting more and more expensive. These days, you could pay around $800 to $1000 (US) for a new model of one of those phones..

    Yes, the prices are getting rather silly.

    Seems a bit steep. There are cellular plans that let you spread out
    that cost so that instead of paying for that up-front, you can pay
    maybe $20-$30 per month for the phone (on top of your phone bill), and they also let you upgrade every 2 years or so if you want. But that
    also means a fairly high cell phone bill (at least, higher than what

    Yes, given that I currently pay $20/month, adding any smartphone is going to dramatically increase the bill.

    I'm used to paying). There's one cell provider I was considering switching to, but I realized that in addition to the base bill cost,
    they also add some kind of phone "access fee", which is in addition to
    and separate from the cost of the phone.. For instance, if you don't
    buy the phone up front, you might pay around $20 per month for the
    price of the phone, plus an extra $20 or so for the phone "access fee"
    on top of the cell phone bill. Seemed pretty ridiculous.. Even if I bought the phone up front, I'd still probably be paying more per month with them than I'm paying now with my current provider.

    This "access fee" sounds dodgy. Here, some telcos have a plan they'll put you on, but if you opt for a more expensive handset than the plan caters for, they'll add a "handset fee", which is an additional monthly charge for the more expensive phone. At least that looks more transparent and makes sense. :)


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 09:49:00
    On 06-19-18 09:52, Nightfox wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    It frustrated me that Netflix was carrying the new Star Trek series (Discovery) in most of the world except the US.. In the US, we'd have
    to subscribe to CBS All Access (yet another streaming service) to watch
    it legally.

    Yeah everyone wants to milk things and the customer gets screwed. At least I'm outside the US, so Netflix works well for me. :)


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 10:13:00
    On 06-19-18 15:23, Nightfox wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    I guess "is" would be better, as I assume they're still carrying it. Season 1 has already ended, which is why I was thinking "was".

    And season 2 hasn't started yet. Looking forward to it.


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  • From Chai@VERT/ECBBS to Nightfox on Tuesday, June 19, 2018 18:15:00
    Nightfox wrote to Chai <=-

    Re: VR
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Fri Jun 15 2018 07:04 pm

    Yeah, but I suppose the same argument could be made for movies..
    Movies aren't interactive, but people still enjoy watching them.

    For me, it's a money issue. After watching a few 3D movies, it doesn't wow me that much to want to pay extra money to see it in 3D. 2D is good enough. The same could also be said for VR, though. After everyone has seen it, they may flock back to the cheaper 2D movies. That alone may be reason enough for cinemas not to invest in it.

    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.51
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  • From Chai@VERT/ECBBS to Vk3jed on Tuesday, June 19, 2018 18:55:00
    Vk3jed wrote to Nightfox <=-

    On 06-18-18 09:33, Nightfox wrote to Hawkeye <=-
    I was the same like "Why would I spend $$$$$ on a .... phone!". But
    after I had seen other peoples' iPhones, I could see the benefits and bought one in 2009, then upgraded in 2011, but more recently, have switched to Android.

    I wasn't an early adopter of smartphones either, but I admit, I'd have a hard time living without 2FA apps and online banking.

    Being able to send money to people with my phone is also a nice perk. Everything else, I could do without, if I had to.



    ... MultiMail, the new multi-platform, multi-format offline reader!
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  • From Chai@VERT/ECBBS to Nightfox on Tuesday, June 19, 2018 19:16:00
    Nightfox wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    It frustrated me that Netflix was carrying the new Star Trek series (Discovery) in most of the world except the US.. In the US, we'd have
    to subscribe to CBS All Access (yet another streaming service) to watch
    it legally.

    The stream wars are just stupid. I get irritated at content providers, sometimes. There was a startup out of NY that was going to place little antennas in elevated buildings and such. They were going to stream out the signal to people for like $7 a month via the Internet. They were basically just renting antennas and infastructure, as you can't pick up all of the local stations in most houses in low lying areas. It was all over-the-air content that is currently being broadcast for free anyway. The TV stations cried foul, which tells me they don't want you to be able to pick up their OTA signals in the first place. They want you to subscribe to cable, so they get that little extra fee from the cable companies. Cable is overpriced and the rate goes up every six months. How can you call it free (ad-based) TV, if it isn't really free. If they really feel that way towards consumers, they need to go strictly cable and remove their broadcast towers.

    As for Discovery, I watched the first season. It was decent, but I couldn't make myself continue the subscription just so I could watch one show. Discovery was the only reason I had for subscribing to CBS All Access in the first place.

    ... MultiMail, the new multi-platform, multi-format offline reader!
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  • From Chai@VERT/ECBBS to MRO on Tuesday, June 19, 2018 19:29:00
    MRO wrote to Chai <=-

    Re: Re: Media
    By: Chai to MRO on Thu Jun 14 2018 11:48 pm

    I would, however, like to watch a full length horror film in VR, where you have a choice about what to look at in your virtual surroundings. It makes you feel like you're really there.

    now that sounds interesting. better than going around and picking up balls ---

    My nephew has somewhat of a crude demo on his PS4-VR. It's just a short time you spend in this haunted room, and it's more an animation than anything. You hear creaking from the ceiling, look up, and there's a ghost hanging from a noose. Things pop up in different locations at different times, typical of jump scares, but with the element of it actually being closer to you. It was pretty cool. It sounds simple, but it enhanced the experience for me, at least.



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  • From Operations@VERT/SECTONE to Nightfox on Tuesday, June 19, 2018 23:23:52
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to MRO on Thu Jun 14 2018 09:39 am

    I'm surprised when I hear of things that make movies more realistic/life-lik being "too distracting". I've heard the same argument for 3D movies as well We see in 3D, and we can percieve sound from all directions. It's just part how we perceive things. I'm not sure how it could be too distracting..

    Nightfox
    I'm a little late to the conversation, but I love my 3D movies. If I have a choice, I will always pay the extra. I have a 3D tv, that I've enjoyed so much and was very upset to hear that it just never got picked up. Now it's getting harder to find the movies (even though I see them in 3D in theaters) on 3D DVD's. At least there are some sites online that seem to be able to get them, but they sure are costing a more.

    Oh, and there's nothing like watching a 3D Blu Ray disk with the 5.1 surround sound on.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Section One BBS - www.section1bbs.com
  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Chai on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 14:15:00
    On 06-19-18 18:55, Chai wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    I wasn't an early adopter of smartphones either, but I admit, I'd have
    a hard time living without 2FA apps and online banking.

    Those are handy, though I use my phone for a lot more than just that.

    Being able to send money to people with my phone is also a nice perk. Everything else, I could do without, if I had to.

    I've lost track of how many things I do with the phone now. :)


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Chai on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 14:26:00
    On 06-19-18 19:16, Chai wrote to Nightfox <=-

    The stream wars are just stupid. I get irritated at content providers,

    This is the shit that leads to downloads. :/


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  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 00:26:00
    Nightfox wrote to Digital Man <=-

    Re: Re: Media
    By: Digital Man to MRO on Wed Jun 13 2018 08:43 pm


    Years ago I bought a 4.1 speaker system for my computer, but I found
    where I had them set up.. Since then I've always been concerned about

    Yes. They're a pain.

    having extra cables/wires on the floor that could be tripped over and finding space for extra speakers. It almost seems like more hassle
    than it's worth, whether it be a computer sound system or a TV sound system.

    Especially on a computer. If I want surround sound on my PC for gaming, I just use a surround sound headset. Some of them [headsets] are virtual surround, but it seems like there are some in production with multiple drivers to give you a true surround sound effect. As for movies on a PC, I never use my PC for that, other than maybe some Netflix movies on my laptop at night.





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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Vk3jed on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 09:34:35
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Wed Jun 20 2018 09:48 am

    Yes, good point, most tech does go down dramatically over the year - look at computers. Someone's gouging prices of smartphones. At least with Android, there some quite reasonably priced midrange phones on the market from the better Chinese manufacturers.

    My first smartphone was an LG, and was fairly affordable and wasn't bad. Later I upgraded to another LG that had a physical keyboard (the screen slid to the side to reveal the keyboard). I liked the physical keyboard, and I wish more smartphones had them. The thing about that phone, though, was that it didn't have much storage space. I moved a lot of my Android apps to my SD card, but even then, you first had to install an app to the internal storage before you could move it, and sometimes I ran into issues where I didn't have enough internal storage space to install another app.

    it later this year. I also need a phone with a magnetometer (still has to be Android), to interface an app with the new magnetic "gates" build into the resurfaced track in town (only one outside Europe, from what I can tell!), for a performance monitoring app.

    Interesting, I hadn't heard of a magnetometer.

    don't buy the phone up front, you might pay around $20 per month for
    the price of the phone, plus an extra $20 or so for the phone
    "access fee" on top of the cell phone bill. Seemed pretty

    This "access fee" sounds dodgy. Here, some telcos have a plan they'll put you on, but if you opt for a more expensive handset than the plan caters for, they'll add a "handset fee", which is an additional monthly charge for the more expensive phone. At least that looks more transparent and makes sense. :)

    The access fee they charge sounds basically the same as that handset fee.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Vk3jed on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 09:36:51
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Wed Jun 20 2018 10:13 am

    I guess "is" would be better, as I assume they're still carrying it.
    Season 1 has already ended, which is why I was thinking "was".

    And season 2 hasn't started yet. Looking forward to it.

    I am too. I was disappointed that they changed the appearance of the Klingons (yet again, when you consider they changed the appearance of the Klingons in the first Star Trek movie). But I thought Discovery got pretty interesting in the middle and toward the end of season 1 when they were dealing with the mirror universe.

    With the changes with the Klingons, and modern look of the technology, I'm curious how they're going to tie it all in to the original series.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 09:38:56
    Re: Re: VR
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Tue Jun 19 2018 06:15 pm

    For me, it's a money issue. After watching a few 3D movies, it doesn't wow me that much to want to pay extra money to see it in 3D. 2D is good enough. The same could also be said for VR, though. After everyone has seen it, they may flock back to the cheaper 2D movies. That alone may be reason enough for cinemas not to invest in it.

    It seems theaters (at least, in my area) are still showing 3D movies. 3D movies at home might not be working financially, but it seems 3D movies may be doing better in the theaters.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 09:41:41
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Tue Jun 19 2018 07:16 pm

    The stream wars are just stupid. I get irritated at content providers, sometimes. There was a startup out of NY that was going to place little antennas in elevated buildings and such. They were going to stream out the signal to people for like $7 a month via the Internet. They were basically just renting antennas and infastructure, as you can't pick up all of the local stations in most houses in low lying areas. It was all over-the-air content that is currently being broadcast for free anyway. The TV stations cried foul, which tells me they don't want you to be able to pick up their OTA signals in the first place. They want you to subscribe to cable, so

    I don't really see a problem with a company installing antennas and streaming the OTA channels for people who can't pick them all up. It always used to be that with OTA, the stations made their money by selling ads, and the content makers had their content shown on the TV stations. It seemed like it could work out well for all parties. I'm not sure what's wrong with that.

    As for Discovery, I watched the first season. It was decent, but I couldn't make myself continue the subscription just so I could watch one show. Discovery was the only reason I had for subscribing to CBS All Access in the first place.

    yeah.. I wouldn't want to subscribe to another streaming service just for one show either. It just makes me want to watch it in ways they probably don't want people to watch it..

    Nightfox

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    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Operations on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 09:49:44
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Operations to Nightfox on Tue Jun 19 2018 11:23 pm

    I'm a little late to the conversation, but I love my 3D movies. If I have a choice, I will always pay the extra. I have a 3D tv, that I've enjoyed so much and was very upset to hear that it just never got picked up. Now it's getting harder to find the movies (even though I see them in 3D in theaters) on 3D DVD's. At least there are some sites online that seem to be able to get them, but they sure are costing a more.

    Yeah, I'm disappointed that 3D at home didn't take off in the US. The problem with finding 3D movies to buy now is that you may have to buy them from a different region, and they may have region encoding so you normally wouldn't be able to watch them in the US. I bought Terminator 2 3D on Blu-Ray from Amazon UK, but it was a different region. I ended up ripping the blu-ray, removing the region coding, and burning the ripped image to a writeable blu-ray disc so I could watch it.

    Nightfox

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    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 09:52:47
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Wed Jun 20 2018 12:26 am

    Especially on a computer. If I want surround sound on my PC for gaming, I just use a surround sound headset. Some of them [headsets] are virtual surround, but it seems like there are some in production with multiple drivers to give you a true surround sound effect. As for movies on a PC, I never use my PC for that, other than maybe some Netflix movies on my laptop at night.

    A while ago, I realized that producing a surround sound effect from headphones is probably easier to do than with surround-sound speaker systems. I was reading an article on 'binaural' headphones - Basically, the idea is that sound is recorded with 2 microphones mounted on something like a mannequin head, to record the audio that you'd hear with your 2 ears. So when you listen to it with headphones, you can hear the sounds like you're there. I'm not sure if movies can play audio that way, but I'd think that would be an easy way to get the 'surround' effect with headphones.

    Nightfox

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    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 09:52:13
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to poindexter FORTRAN on Tue Jun 19 2018 03:25 pm

    I've heard of people using a VPN to access Netflix content that isn't available in their region.

    I think that horse has run. Now, they either have a static list of proxies or they block based on heuristics. Every time I leave my VPN running and try netflix I get an error specific to proxy access.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Vk3jed on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 09:54:32
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Wed Jun 20 2018 09:48 am

    Yes, good point, most tech does go down dramatically over the year - look at computers.

    I always felt computers stuck to a price point, and the tech increased. Used to be that you could get a $800 standard computer, a $1500 gamer desktop, and a $2000 top-end system. The prices stayed the same, the amount of memory/CPU/disk increased.

    Chromebooks and disposable laptops dropped the low-end of the curve and changed the rest of the prices along the way.

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    þ Synchronet þ realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Chai on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 09:56:44
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Tue Jun 19 2018 07:16 pm

    As for Discovery, I watched the first season. It was decent, but I couldn't make myself continue the subscription just so I could watch one show. Discovery was the only reason I had for subscribing to CBS All Access in the first place.

    I want a show that sticks closer to canon with regards to look and feel; what I really wanted was Prelude to Axanar's costumes, ships, and personalities.

    Richard Hatch (RIP) made a great Klingon, Kate Vernon channeled Majel Barrett's Number One well, and JG Hertzler I love whether he's playing a Klingon, a Human or a Vulcan.

    Not many people recognized him as the captain of the Saratoga in the beginning of DS9.



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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 11:01:46
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to Vk3jed on Wed Jun 20 2018 09:36 am

    I am too. I was disappointed that they changed the appearance of the Klingons (yet again, when you consider they changed the appearance of the Klingons in the first Star Trek movie). But I thought Discovery got pretty interesting in the middle and toward the end of season 1 when they were dealing with the mirror universe.

    I just read a *wonderful* series (1 books) called Star Trek: Vanguard. They fit into the TOS universe and reference lots of canon while exploring new areas.

    They mentioned the 'Augment Virus'. ST:ENT mentioned Augments as being from
    the Eugenics wars, and the modern klingons with the ridges were separated from the old-series klingons who were immune and didn't get the benefits/ridges, and became an inferior caste. Nice touch.

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to poindexter FORTRAN on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 12:30:22
    Re: Re: Media
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Nightfox on Wed Jun 20 2018 11:01 am

    I just read a *wonderful* series (1 books) called Star Trek: Vanguard. They fit into the TOS universe and reference lots of canon while exploring new areas.

    They mentioned the 'Augment Virus'. ST:ENT mentioned Augments as being from the Eugenics wars, and the modern klingons with the ridges were separated from the old-series klingons who were immune and didn't get the benefits/ridges, and became an inferior caste. Nice touch.

    My understanding from Enterprise was that Klingons had ridges in the past, and their experiments with eugenics (where they were mixing genes with humans) had caused them to lose their ridges for a period of time (as shown in the original series), and they gradually got their ridges back (though I don't think it was really explained how their ridges came back).

    Nightfox

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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 14:33:10
    Re: Re: Media
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Nightfox on Wed Jun 20 2018 11:01 am

    I just read a *wonderful* series (1 books) called Star Trek: Vanguard. They fit into the TOS universe and reference lots of canon while exploring new areas.

    10 books, not 1.

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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 14:35:30
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to poindexter FORTRAN on Wed Jun 20 2018 12:30 pm

    They mentioned the 'Augment Virus'. ST:ENT mentioned Augments as being PF>> from the Eugenics wars, and the modern klingons with the ridges were
    separated from the old-series klingons who were immune and didn't get
    the benefits/ridges, and became an inferior caste. Nice touch.


    Yeah, I got it backwards.

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  • From Hawkeye@VERT/MASHBBS to Digital Man on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 18:48:06
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Digital Man to Nightfox on Mon Jun 18 2018 13:17:46

    Apple's iPhone came out (it was the first smartphone on the market), I
    Are you sure about that (iPhone being the "first smartphone")?
    I had a blackberry before the iPhone came out and I'm pretty sure it was considered a "smartphone".

    Smartphone in the modern context like touchscreen yes, the first commonly adapted. The Nokia Communicator 9000 was for me the first multi puprose mobile device, most importantly for reading my emails and answering them on the road. Amazing device for that time.

    HAWKEYE

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  • From Hawkeye@VERT/MASHBBS to Vk3jed on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 18:49:58
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Hawkeye on Tue Jun 19 2018 09:10:00

    series are "Fast tracked", meaning they air here within 24 hours of their original airing.
    Shows like Dr Who do this, as did Game of Thrones (after they realised fans here were downloading it simply to keep up with their US friends).

    Netflix is working well for this reason. Series aired/online in US, day later with subtitles... why bother downloading rips etc... well done Netflix.


    HAWKEYE

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  • From Hawkeye@VERT/MASHBBS to Vk3jed on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 18:52:23
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Tue Jun 19 2018 09:28:00

    I was the same like "Why would I spend $$$$$ on a .... phone!". But after I

    I think you need to have a goal for it. In the 90s I remember paying 3000+ USD for mobile phones which could only be used for calling and texting. I don't get the samsung/iphone top model oh so expensive attitude as it was more expensive before.

    Also look at people complaining for buying a PC or laptop for 400 USD... what? in the 80s we had to pay 300-400 for only the OS...


    HAWKEYE

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  • From Hawkeye@VERT/MASHBBS to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 18:54:21
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to Vk3jed on Tue Jun 19 2018 09:52:05

    It frustrated me that Netflix was carrying the new Star Trek series (Discovery) in most of the world except the US.. In the US, we'd have to subscribe to CBS All Access (yet another streaming service) to watch it legally.

    That was weird indeed, but for me it was a blessing.

    HAWKEYE

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  • From Hawkeye@VERT/MASHBBS to Vk3jed on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 18:55:42
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Wed Jun 20 2018 09:37:00

    And some TV series too. :)

    For this reason I have my Plex server. Series I want to rewatch. Star Trek, M*A*S*H 4077, other scifi series. Netflix is sometimes a little bit too fast with deleting stuff.


    HAWKEYE

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Hawkeye on Wednesday, June 20, 2018 17:18:12
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Hawkeye to Vk3jed on Wed Jun 20 2018 06:52 pm

    I think you need to have a goal for it. In the 90s I remember paying 3000+ USD for mobile phones which could only be used for calling and texting. I don't get the samsung/iphone top model oh so expensive attitude as it was more expensive before.

    Also look at people complaining for buying a PC or laptop for 400 USD... what? in the 80s we had to pay 300-400 for only the OS...

    I've never paid $3000 for a phone, so for me that seems a bit ridiculous.. Besides, technology prices typically go down. We aren't paying 80s prices for electronics anymore. Unless I'm upgrading to a higher class of phone, I wouldn't expect a new smartphone to cost too much more than my last one. As an example, my current phone is a Samsung Galaxy S7 which I bought just less than 2 years ago, and it was about $600 if I remember correctly. So if I bought a newer one now, why would I want to pay $800 or $1000 for a new one?

    Sometimes people just don't want to spend money if they don't need to. If your current PC is working just fine for you and then suddenly it stops working, do you really want to spend even $400 for a new one? It may be an unexpected expense.

    If $300-$400 for an OS still seams reasonable to you, then by all means, give them that much money next time you buy an OS..

    Nightfox

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  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Vk3jed on Thursday, June 21, 2018 03:01:35
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Chai on Wed Jun 20 2018 14:15:00

    I've lost track of how many things I do with the phone now. :)

    I'd do a lot more with my phone if I had more space. I found out quickly that 16GB is way too small for a smartphone. Facebook, FBMessenger and Google+ chew up the largest amount of space on my phone, so I could delete those. The only problem is that I actually use the apps from time to time. I'll eventually have to upgrade to a phone with more storage.

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  • From Dreamer@VERT to Nightfox on Thursday, June 21, 2018 01:05:00
    Nightfox wrote to Chai <=-

    A while ago, I realized that producing a surround sound effect from headphones is probably easier to do than with surround-sound speaker systems. I was reading an article on 'binaural' headphones -
    Basically, the idea is that sound is recorded with 2 microphones
    mounted on something like a mannequin head, to record the audio that
    you'd hear with your 2 ears. So when you listen to it with headphones, you can hear the sounds like you're there. I'm not sure if movies can play audio that way, but I'd think that would be an easy way to get the 'surround' effect with headphones.

    There's a guy with a YouTube channel who travels and records experiences
    for public consumption using biaural audio. His channel name is "The Sound Traveler". He also runs "SmarterEveryDay", pretty cool guy. He has even captured the Falcon Heavy launch and put it up in binaural format.


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  • From Dreamer@VERT to Nightfox on Thursday, June 21, 2018 01:20:00
    Nightfox wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    They mentioned the 'Augment Virus'. ST:ENT mentioned Augments as being from the Eugenics wars, and the modern klingons with the ridges were separated from the old-series klingons who were immune and didn't get the benefits/ridges, and became an inferior caste. Nice touch.

    My understanding from Enterprise was that Klingons had ridges in the
    past, and their experiments with eugenics (where they were mixing genes with humans) had caused them to lose their ridges for a period of time
    (as shown in the original series), and they gradually got their ridges back (though I don't think it was really explained how their ridges
    came back).

    It has never been addressed in canon if there remain any families without ridges. For years after the outbreak, so many Klingons had been affected,
    the Empire learned to tolerate the affliction. The changes were passed on
    to offspring, so one could imagine the changes went on for generations.

    I would guess if some future episode addresses this, it would go one of two ways. Of course, some cure could have been developed that ended it in one generation. More likely, since they were considered a lower caste, their
    number dwindled until the last were expelled from the Empire or killed.


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Thursday, June 21, 2018 13:06:00
    On 06-20-18 09:34, Nightfox wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    My first smartphone was an LG, and was fairly affordable and wasn't
    bad. Later I upgraded to another LG that had a physical keyboard (the screen slid to the side to reveal the keyboard). I liked the physical keyboard, and I wish more smartphones had them. The thing about that phone, though, was that it didn't have much storage space. I moved a
    lot of my Android apps to my SD card, but even then, you first had to install an app to the internal storage before you could move it, and sometimes I ran into issues where I didn't have enough internal storage space to install another app.

    Yeah there were some good phones early on. Physical keyboard can work either way for me.

    Interesting, I hadn't heard of a magnetometer.

    In every phone with a magnetic compass. :)

    The access fee they charge sounds basically the same as that handset
    fee.

    "Handset fee" sounds a bit more honest though - it's a premium for paying off a more expenbsive handset, and I have no problem with that idea.


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Thursday, June 21, 2018 13:14:00
    On 06-20-18 09:36, Nightfox wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    And season 2 hasn't started yet. Looking forward to it.

    I am too. I was disappointed that they changed the appearance of the Klingons (yet again, when you consider they changed the appearance of

    Well, they could have made the Klingons look more human, in line with TOS and the events in Season 4 of Enterprise.

    the Klingons in the first Star Trek movie). But I thought Discovery
    got pretty interesting in the middle and toward the end of season 1
    when they were dealing with the mirror universe.

    Yes, the mirror universe stuff was really good. And with the 9 months absence and worsening of the war, things were getting very interesting.

    With the changes with the Klingons, and modern look of the technology,
    I'm curious how they're going to tie it all in to the original series.

    Yes, that will be interesting too.


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to poindexter FORTRAN on Thursday, June 21, 2018 20:21:00
    On 06-20-18 09:54, poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    I always felt computers stuck to a price point, and the tech increased. Used to be that you could get a $800 standard computer, a $1500 gamer desktop, and a $2000 top-end system. The prices stayed the same, the amount of memory/CPU/disk increased.

    Eventually, but early on, they were all insanely expensive.

    Chromebooks and disposable laptops dropped the low-end of the curve and changed the rest of the prices along the way.

    Yep.


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Hawkeye on Thursday, June 21, 2018 21:05:00
    On 06-20-18 18:49, Hawkeye wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    Netflix is working well for this reason. Series aired/online in US, day later with subtitles... why bother downloading rips etc... well done Netflix.

    Yes, Netflix is probably one of the best (and most popular!) anti piracy measures around. :)


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Hawkeye on Thursday, June 21, 2018 21:10:00
    On 06-20-18 18:52, Hawkeye wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    I was the same like "Why would I spend $$$$$ on a .... phone!". But after I

    I think you need to have a goal for it. In the 90s I remember paying
    3000+ USD for mobile phones which could only be used for calling and texting. I don't get the samsung/iphone top model oh so expensive
    attitude as it was more expensive before.

    Well, by the early 2000s, you could buy a decent phone for a few hundred. Those were the days when Nokia was the brand to have.

    Also look at people complaining for buying a PC or laptop for 400
    USD... what? in the 80s we had to pay 300-400 for only the OS...

    PC prices are not bad.


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Hawkeye on Thursday, June 21, 2018 21:11:00
    On 06-20-18 18:55, Hawkeye wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    For this reason I have my Plex server. Series I want to rewatch. Star Trek, M*A*S*H 4077, other scifi series. Netflix is sometimes a little
    bit too fast with deleting stuff.

    Yes, that would be handy. :)


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Chai on Thursday, June 21, 2018 21:13:00
    On 06-21-18 03:01, Chai wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    @VIA: VERT/AMIGAC
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Chai on Wed Jun 20 2018 14:15:00

    I've lost track of how many things I do with the phone now. :)

    I'd do a lot more with my phone if I had more space. I found out
    quickly that 16GB is way too small for a smartphone. Facebook, FBMessenger and Google+ chew up the largest amount of space on my
    phone, so I could delete those. The only problem is that I actually
    use the apps from time to time. I'll eventually have to upgrade to a phone with more storage.

    32GB works for me on Android, and my old iPhone is a 64GB model (but that one has a lot of music on it).


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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Vk3jed on Thursday, June 21, 2018 08:33:46
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Thu Jun 21 2018 01:06 pm

    The access fee they charge sounds basically the same as that handset
    fee.

    "Handset fee" sounds a bit more honest though - it's a premium for paying off a more expenbsive handset, and I have no problem with that idea.

    The thing is, when I was looking at the phone plans for a particular carrier (AT&T), they would already add a premium for paying off a smartphone. The "access fee" was a separate fee they added in addition to that.

    Nightfox

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Vk3jed on Thursday, June 21, 2018 08:35:31
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Thu Jun 21 2018 01:14 pm

    I am too. I was disappointed that they changed the appearance of
    the Klingons (yet again, when you consider they changed the
    appearance of

    Well, they could have made the Klingons look more human, in line with TOS and the events in Season 4 of Enterprise.

    That's actually what I was expecting with Discovery. I was surprised that they didn't make the Klingons look like they did in TOS, and more surprised they made the Klingons look different in a way we had never seen before. I think they're making the Klingons unnecessarily complicated, since they'll have to explain why they look different again.

    Nightfox

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Thursday, June 21, 2018 08:46:04
    Re: Smartphones
    By: Chai to Vk3jed on Thu Jun 21 2018 03:01 am

    I'd do a lot more with my phone if I had more space. I found out quickly that 16GB is way too small for a smartphone. Facebook, FBMessenger and Google+ chew up the largest amount of space on my phone, so I could delete those. The only problem is that I actually use the apps from time to time. I'll eventually have to upgrade to a phone with more storage.

    What's frustrating is that a lot of phones come with apps that you can't remove even if you wanted to. The Facebook app is one that my phone won't allow me to uninstall. One of my earlier Android phones didn't come with Facebook, but after installing Facebook on it (or maybe an Android update on the phone), I found I was no longer able to uninstall Facebook. I use Facebook, but on my phone, often I'd rather just use their web site rather than their app. One thing that frustrates me is that if someone messages you on Facebook, you can no longer use the Facebook app to reply to messages - They force you to use their separate Messenger app now. If you use their web site though, on your smartphone you can have the browser request the desktop version and you can reply to messages there.

    Nightfox

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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Chai on Thursday, June 21, 2018 08:34:44
    Re: Smartphones
    By: Chai to Vk3jed on Thu Jun 21 2018 03:01 am

    I'd do a lot more with my phone if I had more space. I found out quickly that 16GB is way too small for a smartphone. Facebook, FBMessenger and Google+ chew up the largest amount of space on my phone, so I could delete those. The only problem is that I actually use the apps from time to time. I'll eventually have to upgrade to a phone with more storage.

    Some of the Android phones let you combine internal storage and an SD card, but it apparently can slow the phone down. I have a 128 GB card in my phone, tempted to combine them to get around the limitations.

    The nice thing is being able to load the bigger apps like audible onto the SD card, and apps that are external storage friendly like my podcast app that can store their media there.

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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Dreamer on Thursday, June 21, 2018 08:37:04
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Dreamer to Nightfox on Thu Jun 21 2018 01:20 am

    I would guess if some future episode addresses this, it would go one of two ways. Of course, some cure could have been developed that ended it in one generation. More likely, since they were considered a lower caste, their number dwindled until the last were expelled from the Empire or killed.

    Reminds me of the Remans from ST: Nemesis. Liked the idea, hated the portrayal.

    ---
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  • From Jagossel@VERT/MTLGEEK to Nightfox on Thursday, June 21, 2018 12:59:45
    Re: Smartphones
    By: Nightfox to Chai on Thu Jun 21 2018 08:46:04

    What's frustrating is that a lot of phones come with apps that you can't rem even if you wanted to. The Facebook app is one that my phone won't allow me uninstall. One of my earlier Android phones didn't come with Facebook, but after installing Facebook on it (or maybe an Android update on the phone), I found I was no longer able to uninstall Facebook. I use Facebook, but on my phone, often I'd rather just use their web site rather than their app. One thing that frustrates me is that if someone messages you on Facebook, you ca no longer use the Facebook app to reply to messages - They force you to use their separate Messenger app now. If you use their web site though, on your smartphone you can have the browser request the desktop version and you can reply to messages there.

    Certain Android phones will let you disable the crapware apps that is permanently on your phone, but it's not a full uninstall.

    It aggervates me to no end, as well, that they will do that: install apps that they think an avgerage user would install. Makes it difficult for users like us who don't care about these apps to remove.

    PCs are the same way as well, but at least you uninstall most of it. Some apps that come with Windows that Microsoft wrote themselves cannot come off, nor do I want them.

    -jag
    Code it, Script it, Automate it!

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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Nightfox on Thursday, June 21, 2018 11:28:39
    Re: Smartphones
    By: Nightfox to Chai on Thu Jun 21 2018 08:46 am

    What's frustrating is that a lot of phones come with apps that you can't remove even if you wanted to. The Facebook app is one that my phone won't allow me to uninstall. One of my earlier Android phones didn't come with Facebook, but after installing Facebook on it (or maybe an Android update on the phone), I found I was no longer able to uninstall Facebook.

    I use Cricket Wireless with an AT&T phone, and there's close to a dozen AT&T apps that don't work. If your android phone's bootloader can be locked, you can load a neutral version of Android; I use LineageOS on an older Samsung S3 I have, and it's remarkably crap free.

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Jagossel on Thursday, June 21, 2018 12:59:15
    Re: Smartphones
    By: Jagossel to Nightfox on Thu Jun 21 2018 12:59 pm

    What's frustrating is that a lot of phones come with apps that you
    can't rem even if you wanted to. The Facebook app is one that my
    phone won't allow me uninstall. One of my earlier Android phones

    Certain Android phones will let you disable the crapware apps that is permanently on your phone, but it's not a full uninstall.

    That's correct.

    It aggervates me to no end, as well, that they will do that: install apps that they think an avgerage user would install. Makes it difficult for users like us who don't care about these apps to remove.

    It would be nice if they would let users install what they want and not have the non-uninstallable apps taking up space unnecessarily.

    PCs are the same way as well, but at least you uninstall most of it. Some apps that come with Windows that Microsoft wrote themselves cannot come off, nor do I want them.

    That's one reason I like to build my own PC. I only install the software I want. Also, Windows 10 now has a built-in "reset to factory" feature, which hopefully would let users reset Windows back to a clean state without all the stuff the PC maker installs.. though I'm not sure if Windows 10's reset feature always goes back to a plain Windows install or if it would keep a set of default software installed by the PC maker.

    Windows does come with Microsoft stuff that I don't use.. And one thing I find interesting is that Apple has often advertised that their Macs come with a lot of good free Apple software, such as iPhoto, Garage Band, etc., but these days I've been seeing Mac users post on online forums that they actually don't use or need a lot of the software that Apple includes.

    Nightfox

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to poindexter FORTRAN on Thursday, June 21, 2018 13:01:31
    Re: Smartphones
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Nightfox on Thu Jun 21 2018 11:28 am

    I use Cricket Wireless with an AT&T phone, and there's close to a dozen AT&T apps that don't work. If your android phone's bootloader can be locked, you can load a neutral version of Android; I use LineageOS on an older Samsung S3 I have, and it's remarkably crap free.

    I've thought of trying to find a clean Android OS image for my phone, but I'm nervous to actually try that. I would be most nervous about the phone no longer working with my carrier. Also, there are some Samsung apps I've used (such as their 'Internet' browser) on my phone, so I'm not sure if I'd want a plain vanilla Google Android image. Also, it used to be that Samsung had their own voice assistant, but now I think a voice assistant is standard in Android from Google.

    Nightfox

    ---
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to poindexter FORTRAN on Thursday, June 21, 2018 13:03:15
    Re: Smartphones
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Chai on Thu Jun 21 2018 08:34 am

    Some of the Android phones let you combine internal storage and an SD card, but it apparently can slow the phone down. I have a 128 GB card in my phone, tempted to combine them to get around the limitations.

    I currently have a 32GB card in my phone, and I've thought about buying a bigger one. Typically my music library was the largest thing I store on my phone, but as I take more photos with my phone, photos are slowly taking up more storage on my phone. Typically I use a dedicated camera if I want to take quality photos though.

    Nightfox

    ---
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to poindexter FORTRAN on Thursday, June 21, 2018 13:07:21
    Re: Re: Media
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Dreamer on Thu Jun 21 2018 08:37 am

    Reminds me of the Remans from ST: Nemesis. Liked the idea, hated the portrayal.

    One thing that bugged me about Nemesis is that it introduced (and retconned) some new things that were never seen in Star Trek before. I had never heard of the Reimans before Nemesis, but apparently the Remans were closely related to the Romulans. Also, I think it's both funny & odd how they try to parallel some of Earth mythology in Star Trek. The Romans have Romulus and Remus, so in Star Trek they created Romulans and Remans.. It seems unlikely that there would be a couple of alien races whose names happen to parallel something from Earth history (though, those could entirely be human names for them).

    Also, Nemesis introduced B-4, an early Soong android that was never mentioned before...

    Another thing that bugged me about Nemesis was that they showed a photo of Picard in his academy days, and he was bald (as was Picard's clone). That contradicted the TNG episode "Tapestry", which showed Picard in his academy days looking much different from the photo shown in Nemesis. According to that episode, Picard had hair in those days.

    Nightfox

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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Friday, June 22, 2018 06:35:00
    On 06-21-18 08:33, Nightfox wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    The thing is, when I was looking at the phone plans for a particular carrier (AT&T), they would already add a premium for paying off a smartphone. The "access fee" was a separate fee they added in addition
    to that.

    Yeah, that sucks. I've seen plans where you get a particular phone, but they offer a choice of phones, and the more expensive choices have the additional handset fee, while the cheaper phone just has the plan fee.


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Friday, June 22, 2018 06:36:00
    On 06-21-18 08:35, Nightfox wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    That's actually what I was expecting with Discovery. I was surprised
    that they didn't make the Klingons look like they did in TOS, and more surprised they made the Klingons look different in a way we had never
    seen before. I think they're making the Klingons unnecessarily complicated, since they'll have to explain why they look different
    again.

    Yes, they would certainly have been better off giving the makeup/costume department a break. Less would have been more when it came to preserving canon.
    :D


    ... Science is nothing but trained and organized common sense.
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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Friday, June 22, 2018 07:14:00
    On 06-21-18 08:46, Nightfox wrote to Chai <=-

    What's frustrating is that a lot of phones come with apps that you
    can't remove even if you wanted to. The Facebook app is one that my
    phone won't allow me to uninstall. One of my earlier Android phones didn't come with Facebook, but after installing Facebook on it (or
    maybe an Android update on the phone), I found I was no longer able to uninstall Facebook. I use Facebook, but on my phone, often I'd rather just use their web site rather than their app. One thing that

    Hmm, prefer the website? I find web interfaces to be the uglier version of what's available, though FB is not too bad on a PC. Not keen on it on mobile web though, I prefer the FB suite of apps.

    frustrates me is that if someone messages you on Facebook, you can no longer use the Facebook app to reply to messages - They force you to
    use their separate Messenger app now. If you use their web site
    though, on your smartphone you can have the browser request the desktop version and you can reply to messages there.

    Yeah I have a lot of other issues with web apps on the phone - from navigation to notifications, I'm very picky how notifications are done, both visually and audibly, because I often filter them as I hear them. And that was one thing that did piss me off about a FB app upgrade they changed the notification sound and then took away the setting to customise it. I've got used to it now (it's similar to that from another app). Messenger is good, because it's a unique sound.


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Jagossel on Friday, June 22, 2018 07:16:00
    On 06-21-18 12:59, Jagossel wrote to Nightfox <=-

    Certain Android phones will let you disable the crapware apps that is permanently on your phone, but it's not a full uninstall.

    Mine came with stock Android, no crapware, which I liked. :)


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Friday, June 22, 2018 07:18:00
    On 06-21-18 12:59, Nightfox wrote to Jagossel <=-

    Windows does come with Microsoft stuff that I don't use.. And one
    thing I find interesting is that Apple has often advertised that their Macs come with a lot of good free Apple software, such as iPhoto,
    Garage Band, etc., but these days I've been seeing Mac users post on online forums that they actually don't use or need a lot of the
    software that Apple includes.

    When I had the Mac, I actually did make heavy use of iMovie, which was the best video editing program that I've ever used. Really nice and intuitive UI, like nothing else I've ever used.


    ... Mental compatability not covered by warranty.
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Vk3jed on Thursday, June 21, 2018 16:48:32
    Re: Re: Smartphones
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Fri Jun 22 2018 07:14 am

    to uninstall Facebook. I use Facebook, but on my phone, often I'd
    rather just use their web site rather than their app. One thing
    that

    Hmm, prefer the website? I find web interfaces to be the uglier version of what's available, though FB is not too bad on a PC. Not keen on it on mobile web though, I prefer the FB suite of apps.

    I don't mind using their Facebook app on my phone, except that now you can't message people directly from the Facebook app - You have to use their Messenger app for that now.

    Messenger is good, because it's a unique sound.

    I just didn't like the idea of using yet another app for messaging people on Facebook on my phone. Also, the Messenger app seems to want to be a combined messaging app for Facebook as well as contacts on my phone.. For my phone contacts, I'd rather just keep using the built-in Android messenging app.

    Nightfox

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Vk3jed on Thursday, June 21, 2018 16:50:35
    Re: Re: Smartphones
    By: Vk3jed to Nightfox on Fri Jun 22 2018 07:18 am

    Windows does come with Microsoft stuff that I don't use.. And one
    thing I find interesting is that Apple has often advertised that
    their Macs come with a lot of good free Apple software, such as
    iPhoto, Garage Band, etc., but these days I've been seeing Mac users
    post on online forums that they actually don't use or need a lot of
    the software that Apple includes.

    When I had the Mac, I actually did make heavy use of iMovie, which was the best video editing program that I've ever used. Really nice and intuitive UI, like nothing else I've ever used.

    If it's something that's useful to you, it's great that Apple includes the software and that it's easy to use. For people who complain about the
    included software they don't use, I think their main complaint was that perhaps Apple could offer an option to not include all that software and charge a little less for the Mac.

    Nightfox

    ---
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  • From Operations@VERT/SECTONE to Hawkeye on Thursday, June 21, 2018 19:38:17
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Hawkeye to Vk3jed on Wed Jun 20 2018 06:52 pm

    Also look at people complaining for buying a PC or laptop for 400 USD... wha in the 80s we had to pay 300-400 for only the OS...


    HAWKEYE
    That is so funny. I remember when I went to a computer show and came home with a big old smile on my face because I got such a great deal. I got a 20MB (yep you read it right) hard drive for $200!

    ---
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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Nightfox on Thursday, June 21, 2018 21:25:39
    Re: Smartphones
    By: Nightfox to poindexter FORTRAN on Thu Jun 21 2018 01:01 pm

    I've thought of trying to find a clean Android OS image for my phone, but I'm nervous to actually try that. I would be most nervous about the phone no longer working with my carrier. Also, there are some Samsung apps I've used (such as their 'Internet' browser) on my phone, so I'm not sure if I'd want a plain vanilla Google Android image. Also, it used to be that Samsung had their own voice assistant, but now I think a voice assistant is standard in Android from Google.

    There are backup programs for Android that let you do a bare metal restore back to the factory defaults. You can also get a factory image from the carrier.

    I'll miss the Samsung Health app, and I prefer the Samsung browser over Chrome, since it logs into wifi portal pages more easily. There are third-party browsers that act like the Samsung one.

    Google voice assistant rocks compared to the stock Samsung assistant.

    As I mentioned, I have a stock S5 and a S3 running LineageOS so I can compare the two, mostly.

    ---
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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Nightfox on Thursday, June 21, 2018 21:27:33
    Re: Smartphones
    By: Nightfox to poindexter FORTRAN on Thu Jun 21 2018 01:03 pm

    I currently have a 32GB card in my phone, and I've thought about buying a bigger one. Typically my music library was the largest thing I store on my phone, but as I take more photos with my phone, photos are slowly taking up more storage on my phone. Typically I use a dedicated camera if I want to take quality photos though.

    I started uploading my music to Google Play Music - you can store 50,000 songs for free, and delete them off your phone if you want. Google has a podcast app, too - stores the podcasts in the cloud. Audio's pretty low-bandwidth, you could clear all the MP3s off your phone if you have decent cell phone coverage, and use the space for other things.

    ---
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Operations on Thursday, June 21, 2018 22:25:30
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Operations to Hawkeye on Thu Jun 21 2018 07:38 pm

    That is so funny. I remember when I went to a computer show and came home with a big old smile on my face because I got such a great deal. I got a 20MB (yep you read it right) hard drive for $200!

    My first computer was a hand-me-down home-built PC with a 286 processor and a 10MB hard drive. Those old drives were big MFM drives that were full-height (they took 2 5.25" drive bays) and were louder & used more power than today's drives. Also I remember they were less reliable.. I remember having to low-level format them and have the low-level formatting software mark the bad sectors so that the OS wouldn't try to use the bad sectors.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to poindexter FORTRAN on Friday, June 22, 2018 09:26:32
    Re: Smartphones
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Nightfox on Thu Jun 21 2018 09:27 pm

    I started uploading my music to Google Play Music - you can store 50,000 songs for free, and delete them off your phone if you want. Google has a podcast app, too - stores the podcasts in the cloud. Audio's pretty low-bandwidth, you could clear all the MP3s off your phone if you have decent cell phone coverage, and use the space for other things.

    Nah, the reason I like to store my music on my phone is so that I don't have to rely on cell phone coverage or a streaming service to play my own music.

    Nightfox

    ---
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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Friday, June 22, 2018 22:24:00
    On 06-21-18 16:48, Nightfox wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    I don't mind using their Facebook app on my phone, except that now you can't message people directly from the Facebook app - You have to use their Messenger app for that now.

    True, though on Android, it looks like the old internal FB messaging
    apability.

    Messenger is good, because it's a unique sound.

    I just didn't like the idea of using yet another app for messaging
    people on Facebook on my phone. Also, the Messenger app seems to want
    to be a combined messaging app for Facebook as well as contacts on my phone.. For my phone contacts, I'd rather just keep using the built-in Android messenging app.

    I've never had Messenger try to take over my contacts. I still use a separate app (currently TrueCaller, to filter out spam texts) for standard text
    essages.


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Friday, June 22, 2018 22:27:00
    On 06-21-18 16:50, Nightfox wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    If it's something that's useful to you, it's great that Apple includes
    the software and that it's easy to use. For people who complain about
    the included software they don't use, I think their main complaint was that perhaps Apple could offer an option to not include all that
    software and charge a little less for the Mac.

    Yeah. I find on a PC or Mac, the provided apps are less intrusive, with the bigger screen real estate and storage. Pre-installed apps are more intrusive on mobile devices, where screen and storage are at a premium.


    ... Copper wire was invented by two Ferengi fighting over a penny.
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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Operations on Saturday, June 23, 2018 08:24:00
    On 06-21-18 19:38, Operations wrote to Hawkeye <=-

    That is so funny. I remember when I went to a computer show and came
    home with a big old smile on my face because I got such a great deal.
    I got a 20MB (yep you read it right) hard drive for $200!

    Those were the days! :D


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Saturday, June 23, 2018 08:28:00
    On 06-21-18 22:25, Nightfox wrote to Operations <=-

    My first computer was a hand-me-down home-built PC with a 286 processor and a 10MB hard drive. Those old drives were big MFM drives that were

    Mine was an 8088 XT clone. I initially had twin floppies, 2 x 360k I think, then swapped in a 720k 3.5" floppy for B:. Some time later, I managed to scrounge a half height 10MB MFM drive. Not long after I started the BBS, I upgraded to a full height 20MB drive. That and the 70MB I had later weight a ton and sounded like a machine shop when running. :)

    full-height (they took 2 5.25" drive bays) and were louder & used more power than today's drives. Also I remember they were less reliable..
    I remember having to low-level format them and have the low-level formatting software mark the bad sectors so that the OS wouldn't try to use the bad sectors.

    Yep, been there, done that. :D


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to poindexter FORTRAN on Saturday, June 23, 2018 08:30:00
    On 06-21-18 21:27, poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Nightfox <=-

    I started uploading my music to Google Play Music - you can store
    50,000 songs for free, and delete them off your phone if you want.
    Google has a podcast app, too - stores the podcasts in the cloud.
    Audio's pretty low-bandwidth, you could clear all the MP3s off your
    phone if you have decent cell phone coverage, and use the space for
    other things.

    Then you're at the mercy of carriers. I really don't like the idea of streaming music for mobile use.


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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Nightfox on Saturday, June 23, 2018 08:53:00
    On 06-22-18 09:26, Nightfox wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    Nah, the reason I like to store my music on my phone is so that I don't have to rely on cell phone coverage or a streaming service to play my
    own music.

    Same here, and I do frequently go places where there is little or no coverage. Nothing worse than your road tunes dying while on the road. :)


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  • From Hawkeye@VERT/MASHBBS to poindexter FORTRAN on Friday, June 22, 2018 21:25:29
    Re: Re: Media
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Vk3jed on Wed Jun 20 2018 09:54:32

    I always felt computers stuck to a price point, and the tech increased. Used to be that you could get a $800 standard computer, a $1500 gamer desktop, and a $2000 top-end system. The prices stayed the same, the amount of memory/CPU/disk increased.

    weird, I guess Im too old.... in the 80/90s 5000-6000 USD gave you a entry level PC and the OS costed about 200-400 USD. My first laptop was 18k. Now my XPS15 is 2k. My PC is a good workstation but doesn't top my old PC machines. MY complete Amiga was 20k on hardware alone. My first 120MB (MB!) HDD for my BBS was 600 USD, back then, I'm sure if you calculate inflation etc... its now equivilent on 1000 USD for 120MB..... Look what you get now for 1000 USD... a fast NVME SSD of 1 TB.... just... wow..how cheap hardware got.

    HAWKEYE

    - MASH BBS - mash4077.ddns.net - The Netherlands -

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  • From Hawkeye@VERT/MASHBBS to Nightfox on Friday, June 22, 2018 21:36:56
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to Hawkeye on Wed Jun 20 2018 17:18:12

    I've never paid $3000 for a phone, so for me that seems a bit ridiculous..

    Because you have no use or no business use for it.

    an example, my current phone is a Samsung Galaxy S7 which I bought just less than 2 years ago, and it was about $600 if I remember correctly. So if I bought a newer one now, why would I want to pay $800 or $1000 for a new one?

    True, if it does the job why not. But you bought a flag ship 2 years ago. Actually Im using a S7 Edge also at the moment. But people buy a Samsung for 200 USD and complaining Android is so slow... nope... is slow hardware for budget money. Sometimes buying a flagship/high end model of 1-2 years old is better than a cheap ass model.

    HAWKEYE

    - MASH BBS - mash4077.ddns.net - The Netherlands -

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  • From Hawkeye@VERT/MASHBBS to Operations on Friday, June 22, 2018 21:43:45
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Operations to Hawkeye on Thu Jun 21 2018 19:38:17

    That is so funny. I remember when I went to a computer show and came home with a big old smile on my face because I got such a great deal. I got a 20MB (yep you read it right) hard drive for $200!

    Yeah those were the times... like an 8 MB (!) upgrade for my Amiga 2000 for $ 1600.... bargain from 2000 LOL....

    And that HDD you talk about.... I remember a 10 MB MFM that was even SLOWER than the floppy drive... no no the consultant told us, starting WP from the floppy and saving the docs to the HDD... and if more docs you can copy from hdd to floppy... wow.. what a times. And the noise... like an airplane or train in your room lol

    HAWKEYE

    - MASH BBS - mash4077.ddns.net - The Netherlands -

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  • From Hawkeye@VERT/MASHBBS to Nightfox on Friday, June 22, 2018 21:45:14
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to Operations on Thu Jun 21 2018 22:25:30

    My first computer was a hand-me-down home-built PC with a 286 processor and a 10MB hard drive. Those old drives were big MFM drives that were full-height (they took 2 5.25" drive bays) and were louder & used more power than today's drives. Also I remember they were less reliable.. I remember having to low-level format them and have the low-level formatting software mark the bad sectors so that the OS wouldn't try to use the bad sectors.


    Yeah me too, 10 MB with a NEC v20 turbo xt.. lol

    HAWKEYE

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    ---
    þ Synchronet þ MASH4077.DDNS.NET - MASH BBS - The Netherlands
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Hawkeye on Friday, June 22, 2018 17:15:46
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Hawkeye to Nightfox on Fri Jun 22 2018 09:36 pm

    an example, my current phone is a Samsung Galaxy S7 which I bought
    just less than 2 years ago, and it was about $600 if I remember
    correctly. So if I bought a newer one now, why would I want to pay
    $800 or $1000 for a new one?

    True, if it does the job why not. But you bought a flag ship 2 years ago. Actually Im using a S7 Edge also at the moment. But people buy a Samsung for 200 USD and complaining Android is so slow... nope... is slow hardware for budget money. Sometimes buying a flagship/high end model of 1-2 years old is better than a cheap ass model.

    I agree. And what I was saying was that I bought a flagship phone 2 years ago for around $600, so it doesn't feel good that the current flagship phones are more expensive than that now. Though, I didn't buy the 'edge' model, just the plain Galaxy S7, and perhaps I got a deal on it.. I think I found it on eBay (and it was still new and unwrapped).

    Nightfox

    ---
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Hawkeye on Friday, June 22, 2018 17:19:14
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Hawkeye to poindexter FORTRAN on Fri Jun 22 2018 09:25 pm

    weird, I guess Im too old.... in the 80/90s 5000-6000 USD gave you a entry level PC and the OS costed about 200-400 USD. My first laptop was 18k. Now my XPS15 is 2k. My PC is a good workstation but doesn't top my old PC

    $18k for a laptop seems crazy. Back in those days, that was more than a lot of cars cost.. And you can still buy a fairly good car for that much today.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Hawkeye on Friday, June 22, 2018 17:20:44
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Hawkeye to Operations on Fri Jun 22 2018 09:43 pm

    Yeah those were the times... like an 8 MB (!) upgrade for my Amiga 2000 for $ 1600.... bargain from 2000 LOL....

    Yeah, I remember when RAM cost around $100 or more per megabyte in the early 90s. I used to think I wouldn't be able to afford a good PC at those prices.

    Nightfox

    ---
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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Nightfox on Friday, June 22, 2018 17:43:59
    Re: Smartphones
    By: Nightfox to poindexter FORTRAN on Fri Jun 22 2018 09:26 am

    Nah, the reason I like to store my music on my phone is so that I don't have to rely on cell phone coverage or a streaming service to play my own music.

    Agreed - makes a nice, "always with you" backup of your music, too.

    ---
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  • From Ed Vance@VERT/CAPCITY2 to Nightfox on Friday, June 22, 2018 21:00:00
    06-21-18 12:59 Nightfox wrote to Jagossel about Smartphones
    Howdy! Nightfox and Jagossel,

    @VIA: VERT/DIGDIST
    @MSGID: <5B2C0393.36029.dove_dove-gen@digitaldistortionbbs.com>
    @REPLY: <5B2BD981.15776.dove-general@mtlgeek.synchro.net>
    Re: Smartphones
    By: Jagossel to Nightfox on Thu Jun 21 2018 12:59 pm

    What's frustrating is that a lot of phones come with apps that you
    can't rem even if you wanted to. The Facebook app is one that my
    phone won't allow me uninstall. One of my earlier Android phones

    Certain Android phones will let you disable the junk apps that is permanently on your phone, but it's not a full uninstall.

    That's correct.

    It aggervates me to no end, as well, that they will do that: install apps that they think an avgerage user would install. Makes it difficult for users like us who don't care about these apps to remove.

    It would be nice if they would let users install what they want and not have the non-uninstallable apps taking up space unnecessarily.

    What You All are writing made me think of this:

    Maybe the Android manufacturers could offer Two Models for different users.

    A Regular unit for people who don't fiddle with their phone.

    A Deluxe unit for people who DO fiddle with their phone(s).


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  • From Derision@VERT/AMIGAC to Nightfox on Saturday, June 23, 2018 01:19:50
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to Vk3jed on Wed Jun 20 2018 09:36:51

    I am too. I was disappointed that they changed the appearance of the Klingons (yet again, when you consider they changed the appearance of the Klingons in the first Star Trek movie). But I thought Discovery got pretty interesting in the middle and toward the end of season 1 when they were dealing with the mirror universe.

    With the changes with the Klingons, and modern look of the technology, I'm curious how they're going to tie it all in to the original series.

    I saw some images from season 2. Looks like, at the very least, they're going to be using more TOS-style uniforms. Also saw some proper Klingon-looking uniforms. So yeah, it'll be interesting to see how they reconcile all that.

    ---
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  • From Jagossel@VERT/MTLGEEK to Ed Vance on Saturday, June 23, 2018 07:32:31
    Re: Re: Smartphones
    By: Ed Vance to Nightfox on Fri Jun 22 2018 21:00:00

    It aggervates me to no end, as well, that they will do that: install ap that they think an avgerage user would install. Makes it difficult for users like us who don't care about these apps to remove.

    It would be nice if they would let users install what they want and not have the non-uninstallable apps taking up space unnecessarily.

    What You All are writing made me think of this:

    Maybe the Android manufacturers could offer Two Models for different users.

    A Regular unit for people who don't fiddle with their phone.

    A Deluxe unit for people who DO fiddle with their phone(s).

    I was thinking the same thing as well, or just have ome brand that targets those who don't want the crapware. I think it may cost more for a manufacture to add a seperate line just for "power users". Chances are, there will be less demand for it as well, and probably drive up the price.

    It would be nice though to have a vanilla Google Android phone as an option.

    -jag
    Code it, Script it, Automate it!

    ---
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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Jagossel on Sunday, June 24, 2018 08:13:00
    On 06-23-18 07:32, Jagossel wrote to Ed Vance <=-

    It would be nice though to have a vanilla Google Android phone as an option.

    Some of the midrange Chinese manufacturers offer just that. I have one of those phones. Vanilla Android also increases the chance that you'll get ongoing updates, because it's less work for the manufacturer to prepare them. They don't need to add their crapware, just the baseband and other hardware specific stuff.




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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to poindexter FORTRAN on Saturday, June 23, 2018 21:04:53
    Re: Re: Media
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Vk3jed on Tue Jun 19 2018 08:24 am

    At home, we've been getting spottier and spottier cell coverage. I think AT&T is starting to sacrifice their traditional 4G bandwidth for VoLTE bandwidth. new AT&T customers with newer phones get the bandwidth, older phones and MVNOs like Cricket Wireless get what's left over.

    i'm on h20 wireless which uses at&t.
    the speeds are fine. maybe you are in a congested area and that is why
    you have problems?
    ---
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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Nightfox on Saturday, June 23, 2018 21:09:52
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to poindexter FORTRAN on Tue Jun 19 2018 09:53 am

    Currently I'm using Virgin Mobile, which is more of a budget cell service. It works most of the time, though in some areas I don't get a good signal. And it seems that Virgin Mobile phones don't have wi-fi calling, and Virgin Mobile doesn't offer microcells either.



    i would drop them and go with an att reseller
    ---
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to MRO on Sunday, June 24, 2018 22:15:00
    Re: Re: Media
    By: MRO to Nightfox on Sat Jun 23 2018 09:09 pm

    Currently I'm using Virgin Mobile, which is more of a budget cell
    service. It works most of the time, though in some areas I don't get a
    good signal. And it seems that Virgin Mobile phones don't have wi-fi
    calling, and Virgin Mobile doesn't offer microcells either.

    i would drop them and go with an att reseller

    I dunno.. I've been fairly satisfied with Virgin Mobile overall, and with AT&T I'd be paying a lot more than I am now.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to poindexter FORTRAN on Monday, June 25, 2018 00:53:10
    Re: Smartphones
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Nightfox on Thu Jun 21 2018 09:25 pm

    There are backup programs for Android that let you do a bare metal restore back to the factory defaults. You can also get a factory image from the carrier.



    you really need root to do anything like that.
    to really make a backup and to really restore.
    my bootloader is locked so i cant do shit and i cant even install my phone's updates due to them pushing this bootloader lock.
    ---
    þ Synchronet þ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to poindexter FORTRAN on Monday, June 25, 2018 00:53:38
    Re: Smartphones
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Nightfox on Thu Jun 21 2018 09:27 pm

    I started uploading my music to Google Play Music - you can store 50,000 songs for free, and delete them off your phone if you want. Google has a podcast app, too - stores the podcasts in the cloud. Audio's pretty


    isnt google play cutting service or something like that? i got an email from them
    ---
    þ Synchronet þ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Nightfox on Monday, June 25, 2018 00:57:10
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to MRO on Sun Jun 24 2018 10:15 pm

    Re: Re: Media
    By: MRO to Nightfox on Sat Jun 23 2018 09:09 pm

    Currently I'm using Virgin Mobile, which is more of a budget cell
    service. It works most of the time, though in some areas I don't get a
    good signal. And it seems that Virgin Mobile phones don't have wi-fi
    calling, and Virgin Mobile doesn't offer microcells either.

    i would drop them and go with an att reseller

    I dunno.. I've been fairly satisfied with Virgin Mobile overall, and with AT&T I'd be paying a lot more than I am now.



    i pay 37/month for h20 wireless. i was a vmobile customer for like 8 years.
    in my area they did some type of traffic shaping. with straightalk or h20 on att i get decent speeds.
    ---
    þ Synchronet þ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Nightfox on Friday, June 22, 2018 07:11:00
    Nightfox wrote to Operations <=-

    My first computer was a hand-me-down home-built PC with a 286 processor and a 10MB hard drive. Those old drives were big MFM drives that were full-height (they took 2 5.25" drive bays) and were louder & used more power than today's drives. Also I remember they were less reliable..
    I remember having to low-level format them and have the low-level formatting software mark the bad sectors so that the OS wouldn't try to use the bad sectors.

    You'd buy a drive with a list of bad sectors taped to it. LL format them
    out and you'd be good to go. Seasonal temperature swings? Probably need to
    LL format it again. Spinrite was your friend, too -- trying to get the interlacing right and blocking off new bad sectors.

    I had 2 32 MB drives in the BBS, and I could tell in the middle of the
    night when the Fido mail run happened by the sound the drives made. In a
    metal PC case. In a closet. With the door closed.




    ... Would you like to wake up from this dream?
    --- MultiMail/XT v0.49
    þ Synchronet þ realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
  • From Hawkeye@VERT/MASHBBS to Nightfox on Tuesday, June 26, 2018 05:32:25
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to Hawkeye on Fri Jun 22 2018 17:15:46

    phones are more expensive than that now. Though, I didn't buy the 'edge' model, just the plain Galaxy S7, and perhaps I got a deal on it.. I think I

    be happy because edge looks nice but I dont like it.

    HAWKEYE

    - MASH BBS - mash4077.ddns.net - The Netherlands -

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ MASH4077.DDNS.NET - MASH BBS - The Netherlands
  • From Hawkeye@VERT/MASHBBS to Nightfox on Tuesday, June 26, 2018 05:39:28
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to Hawkeye on Fri Jun 22 2018 17:19:14

    $18k for a laptop seems crazy. Back in those days, that was more than a lot of cars cost.. And you can still buy a fairly good car for that much today.

    yeps, those were the prices in 1986, a Zenith XT laptop with no battery at all. Bad screen monochrome, 3.5""inch floppydrive and 10 MB MFM HDD.

    Word Perfect 4.2 was 500 USD...

    Those were the prices back then.

    I remember buying 10 copies for an office... 5k


    HAWKEYE

    - MASH BBS - mash4077.ddns.net - The Netherlands -

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ MASH4077.DDNS.NET - MASH BBS - The Netherlands
  • From Static@VERT/SUBCBBS to poindexter FORTRAN on Tuesday, June 26, 2018 11:47:00
    On 06/22/18, poindexter FORTRAN said the following...

    I had 2 32 MB drives in the BBS, and I could tell in the middle of the night when the Fido mail run happened by the sound the drives made. In a metal PC case. In a closet. With the door closed.

    I remember being able to tell which door game users were playing just by the pattern of HDD chatter.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A39 2018/04/21 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: Subcarrier BBS
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to poindexter FORTRAN on Tuesday, June 26, 2018 09:44:44
    Re: Re: Media
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Nightfox on Fri Jun 22 2018 07:11 am

    You'd buy a drive with a list of bad sectors taped to it. LL format them out and you'd be good to go. Seasonal temperature swings? Probably need to LL format it again. Spinrite was your friend, too -- trying to get the interlacing right and blocking off new bad sectors.

    Yep.

    I had 2 32 MB drives in the BBS, and I could tell in the middle of the night when the Fido mail run happened by the sound the drives made. In a metal PC case. In a closet. With the door closed.

    My BBS machine wasn't in a closet back in the day, but I could tell when someone logged on and perhaps what they were doing by the sound of the hard drive.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Nightfox on Tuesday, June 26, 2018 16:00:00
    I've never paid $3000 for a phone, so for me that seems a bit
    ridiculous.. Besides, technology prices typically go down. We aren't

    That's a lot of cash for a phone, for sure.

    Sometimes people just don't want to spend money if they don't need to.
    If your current PC is working just fine for you and then suddenly it
    stops working, do you really want to spend even $400 for a new one? It may be an unexpected expense.

    Not only that, but back in the 80's, most families that had a computer had ONE computer. There was no such thing as tablets and smartphones. In fact, most families back in the 80's didn't even own a computer. There are more products available now that tends to divide our incomes, so purchasing $3,000 computer systems is prohibitive for some (thankfully, cheap manufacturing has given us the solution). Add to that fact that real estate is a larger portion of our income than it was back then, and the purchasing power for electronics and other electives is lessened. I imagine people outside of the US may have had a different experience.

    If $300-$400 for an OS still seams reasonable to you, then by all
    means, give them that much money next time you buy an OS..

    I purchased Windows 95 for $85, full version (more typical of the US pricing).


    ... MultiMail, the new multi-platform, multi-format offline reader!
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.51
    þ Synchronet þ Amiga City - The BBS for the Amiga - more than 2,500+ files
  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Jagossel on Tuesday, June 26, 2018 16:25:00
    Jagossel wrote to Nightfox <=-

    Re: Smartphones
    By: Nightfox to Chai on Thu Jun 21 2018 08:46:04

    Certain Android phones will let you disable the crapware apps that is permanently on your phone, but it's not a full uninstall.

    It aggervates me to no end, as well, that they will do that: install
    apps that they think an avgerage user would install. Makes it difficult for users like us who don't care about these apps to remove.


    Fills up your phone storage quicker. Forces people to buy, yet another, more expensive phone. It urks me too. I don't like things being so disposable. It's bad for the environment.

    ... MultiMail, the new multi-platform, multi-format offline reader!
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.51
    þ Synchronet þ Amiga City - The BBS for the Amiga - more than 2,500+ files
  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Nightfox on Tuesday, June 26, 2018 16:30:00
    Nightfox wrote to Jagossel <=-

    Re: Smartphones
    By: Jagossel to Nightfox on Thu Jun 21 2018 12:59 pm

    That's one reason I like to build my own PC. I only install the
    software I want. Also, Windows 10 now has a built-in "reset to
    factory" feature, which hopefully would let users reset Windows back to
    a clean state without all the stuff the PC maker installs.. though I'm not sure if Windows 10's reset feature always goes back to a plain
    Windows install or if it would keep a set of default software installed
    by the PC maker.

    It's replaced by the manufacturer's own image on a branded machine, typically. However, if you have a digital entitlement, you can use GParted to erase the drive completely, download the Windows 10 installer, and Windows 10 will activate with that entitlement. Voila, no crapware.

    ... MultiMail, the new multi-platform, multi-format offline reader!
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.51
    þ Synchronet þ Amiga City - The BBS for the Amiga - more than 2,500+ files
  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Vk3jed on Tuesday, June 26, 2018 16:54:00
    Vk3jed wrote to Chai <=-

    32GB works for me on Android, and my old iPhone is a 64GB model (but
    that one has a lot of music on it).


    That's probably what I will go with. I *almost* manage with 16GB, so I think 32GB would be enough, for now.

    ... MultiMail, the new multi-platform, multi-format offline reader!
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.51
    þ Synchronet þ Amiga City - The BBS for the Amiga - more than 2,500+ files
  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to poindexter FORTRAN on Tuesday, June 26, 2018 16:57:00
    poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Chai <=-

    Some of the Android phones let you combine internal storage and an SD card, but it apparently can slow the phone down. I have a 128 GB card
    in my phone, tempted to combine them to get around the limitations.

    Being that my phone is inexpensive, the ability to use combined storage is locked out in my OS base. I can move some apps to the SD card (without combined storage), but it is not without bugs. It's also much, much slower when loading a relocated app.

    The nice thing is being able to load the bigger apps like audible onto
    the SD card, and apps that are external storage friendly like my
    podcast app that can store their media there.

    The apps I need to move to SD are social media apps, which do not allow for their apps to be moved to the SD card. At least, not the last time I checked.


    ... MultiMail, the new multi-platform, multi-format offline reader!
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.51
    þ Synchronet þ Amiga City - The BBS for the Amiga - more than 2,500+ files
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Tuesday, June 26, 2018 17:03:04
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Tue Jun 26 2018 04:00 pm

    Not only that, but back in the 80's, most families that had a computer had ONE computer. There was no such thing as tablets and smartphones. In fact, most families back in the 80's didn't even own a computer. There are more products available now that tends to divide our incomes, so purchasing $3,000 computer systems is prohibitive for some (thankfully, cheap manufacturing has given us the solution). Add to that fact that real estate is a larger portion of our income than it was back then, and the purchasing power for electronics and other electives is lessened. I imagine people outside of the US may have had a different experience.

    Yeah, I remember back in those days when not many people knew how to use a computer. And with computers being more expensive back then, I imagine people often had other things they'd rather spend their money on.

    I purchased Windows 95 for $85, full version (more typical of the US pricing).

    That's pretty good for an OS. These days, most of the time I tend to see Windows upgrade editions being sold. And back then, it seemed like the WIndows 95 upgrade edition (for upgrading from Windows 3.1) was fairly common. But I've found full verisons of Windows these days for around $120 or so.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Tuesday, June 26, 2018 17:06:26
    Re: Re: Smartphones
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Tue Jun 26 2018 04:30 pm

    though I'm not sure if Windows 10's reset feature always goes back
    to a plain Windows install or if it would keep a set of default
    software installed by the PC maker.

    It's replaced by the manufacturer's own image on a branded machine, typically. However, if you have a digital entitlement, you can use GParted to erase the drive completely, download the Windows 10 installer, and Windows 10 will activate with that entitlement. Voila, no crapware.

    What is a "digital entitlement"? Is that a serial number, or something else?

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Tuesday, June 26, 2018 17:11:13
    Re: Re: Smartphones
    By: Chai to Jagossel on Tue Jun 26 2018 04:25 pm

    Fills up your phone storage quicker. Forces people to buy, yet another, more expensive phone. It urks me too. I don't like things being so disposable. It's bad for the environment.

    There are places that recycle electronics. And in fact, I remember hearing about a law that went into effect here some years ago where it's now technically illegal to throw away electronics into the garbage. I heard we have to take electronics to a recycling facility now. And I've noticed that Best Buy now has recycling bins for old cell phones. There's also a place I found near me that takes old electronics to be recycled. It's a bit inconvenient though. Similarly, I've heard you really shouldn't throw away old batteries, but it's hard to want to go out of my way to collect old batteries and drop them off at a recycling place.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 27, 2018 01:20:32
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Nightfox to Chai on Tue Jun 26 2018 17:03:04

    Yeah, I remember back in those days when not many people knew how to use a computer. And with computers being more expensive back then, I imagine people often had other things they'd rather spend their money on.

    Yeah, I remember people thinking I was smart because I could use DOS. DOS is pretty basic compared to modern systems CL, but I didn't mind the compliments.

    That's pretty good for an OS. These days, most of the time I tend to see Windows upgrade editions being sold. And back then, it seemed like the WIndows 95 upgrade edition (for upgrading from Windows 3.1) was fairly common. But I've found full verisons of Windows these days for around $120 or so.

    Yeah, the individual price for Windows given inflation isn't bad. It gets a little pricey when you have multiple machines to maintain. I imagine it's not as bad if you live on higher income. Fortunately, I only have two desktops and one of those is a Linux desktop for working on malware infested hard drives.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Amiga City - The BBS for the Amiga - more than 2,500+ files
  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 27, 2018 01:31:59
    Re: Re: Smartphones
    By: Nightfox to Chai on Tue Jun 26 2018 17:06:26

    What is a "digital entitlement"? Is that a serial number, or something else?

    With "most" versions of Windows 10, a hash of your CPU is kept on Microsoft's activation servers when you have an activated version of Windows 10. You only have to use your key one time. Additional installs after that do not require the key. Microsoft already knows your CPU has a valid license and activates on its own. With my HP, even though it's OEM, it contained a digital entitlement, so I was able to download the installer from the Microsoft website and reinstall without all the HP bloat. I was able to skip the part that asks for the key, and once Internet connectivity was established, it activated on its own. It's greatly simplified several reinstallations for me.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Amiga City - The BBS for the Amiga - more than 2,500+ files
  • From Chai@VERT/AMIGAC to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 27, 2018 01:41:19
    Re: Re: Smartphones
    By: Nightfox to Chai on Tue Jun 26 2018 17:11:13

    about a law that went into effect here some years ago where it's now technically illegal to throw away electronics into the garbage. I heard we

    I didn't realize that it was illegal to throw away electronics. As long as they make it easy to recycle the parts, I'm all for it. I know Goodwill recycles some electronics.

    found near me that takes old electronics to be recycled. It's a bit inconvenient though. Similarly, I've heard you really shouldn't throw away old batteries, but it's hard to want to go out of my way to collect old

    Wal-Mart would be a more convenient location for recycling old phones. That's a major complaint with any recycling program...inconvenience. We (U.S.) need to work on that.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Amiga City - The BBS for the Amiga - more than 2,500+ files
  • From Havok@VERT/THEGHETT to Static on Tuesday, June 26, 2018 21:23:57
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Static to poindexter FORTRAN on Tue Jun 26 2018 11:47 am

    I had 2 32 MB drives in the BBS, and I could tell in the middle of
    the night when the Fido mail run happened by the sound the drives
    made. In a metal PC case. In a closet. With the door closed.


    Oh man you made my night, had my first computer a 386 and it was in the bedroom and I remember many a night waking up to hearing the hardrive working, knowing it was messages coming in or people online.

    Wow, thanks what a memory!

    REALLY.....

    Greg Youngblood AKA: Havok

    ... One good turn gets most of the blanket.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ The Ghetto BBS - theghettobbs.com2323
  • From Chai@VERT/ECBBS to poindexter FORTRAN on Wednesday, June 27, 2018 03:11:05
    Re: Re: Media
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Nightfox on Fri Jun 22 2018 07:11:00

    LL format it again. Spinrite was your friend, too -- trying to get the interlacing right and blocking off new bad sectors.

    Steve Gibson is working on SpinRite 7. I'm not sure it's needed on modern hard drives, but I will probably buy it anyway. It does have the ability to refresh bits, which I find useful. I did use that software a lot on my old MFM
    drives.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ electronic chicken bbs - bbs.electronicchicken.com
  • From Hawkeye@VERT/MASHBBS to poindexter FORTRAN on Wednesday, June 27, 2018 12:12:36
    Re: Re: Media
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Nightfox on Fri Jun 22 2018 07:11:00

    I had 2 32 MB drives in the BBS, and I could tell in the middle of the
    night when the Fido mail run happened by the sound the drives made. In a metal PC case. In a closet. With the door closed.

    I had the same! I can't imagine running those machines now in my bedroom. When a kid i didnt worry and i slept good, now i dont want any sound near me :)

    HAWKEYE

    - MASH BBS - mash4077.ddns.net - The Netherlands -

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ MASH4077.DDNS.NET - MASH BBS - The Netherlands
  • From Jagossel@VERT/MTLGEEK to Chai on Wednesday, June 27, 2018 10:43:48
    Re: Re: Smartphones
    By: Chai to Jagossel on Tue Jun 26 2018 16:25:00

    Certain Android phones will let you disable the crapware apps that is permanently on your phone, but it's not a full uninstall.

    It aggervates me to no end, as well, that they will do that: install apps that they think an avgerage user would install. Makes it difficult for users like us who don't care about these apps to remove.

    Fills up your phone storage quicker. Forces people to buy, yet another, mor expensive phone. It urks me too. I don't like things being so disposable. It's bad for the environment.

    Updates to the apps that are in the ROM does fill up space fast. Once I disabled the crapware on my phone, it will remove the updates. Still though, I don't need half of the crap that is included and having those updates does consume too much space.

    I miss Titanium Backup for that reason. It requires a rooted phone (which I'm not comfortable doing), and then you can push those updated apps into the ROM, freeing uo more space.

    -jag
    Code it, Script it, Automate it!

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ MtlGeek - Geeks in Montreal - http://mtlgeek.com/ -
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Wednesday, June 27, 2018 09:25:18
    Re: PC's & OS
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Wed Jun 27 2018 01:20 am

    Yeah, I remember back in those days when not many people knew how to
    use a computer. And with computers being more expensive back then, I
    imagine people often had other things they'd rather spend their money
    on.

    Yeah, I remember people thinking I was smart because I could use DOS. DOS is pretty basic compared to modern systems CL, but I didn't mind the compliments.

    I had the feeling that many people just weren't interested enough in computers to give complements.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Wednesday, June 27, 2018 09:28:28
    Re: Digital Entitlements
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Wed Jun 27 2018 01:31 am

    What is a "digital entitlement"? Is that a serial number, or
    something else?

    With "most" versions of Windows 10, a hash of your CPU is kept on Microsoft's activation servers when you have an activated version of Windows 10. You only have to use your key one time. Additional installs after that do not require the key. Microsoft already knows your CPU has a valid license and activates on its own. With my HP, even though it's OEM,

    I'm wondering what happens if you upgrade your CPU. Does your Windows license become invalidated and you need to buy a new copy of Windows, or does Microsoft allow re-use when your CPU is upgraded?

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Chai on Wednesday, June 27, 2018 09:30:37
    Re: Re: Smartphones
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Wed Jun 27 2018 01:41 am

    Wal-Mart would be a more convenient location for recycling old phones. That's a major complaint with any recycling program...inconvenience. We (U.S.) need to work on that.

    Assuming there's a Wal-Mart near you, that would be convenient.. And it may need to be a full Wal-Mart. Where I am, there are a few Wal-Marts, but they're only the grocery stores, not the full Wal-Marts.

    Nightfox

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Derision@VERT/AMIGAC to Nightfox on Wednesday, June 27, 2018 20:08:31
    Re: Digital Entitlements
    By: Nightfox to Chai on Wed Jun 27 2018 09:28:28

    I'm wondering what happens if you upgrade your CPU. Does your Windows license become invalidated and you need to buy a new copy of Windows, or does Microsoft allow re-use when your CPU is upgraded?

    There is a way to keep your license after you've changed CPUs. Actually, I feel like it's almost any component of the machine. I had to contact Microsoft to retain my license after swapping out a hard drive and RAM -- Windows had decided that the machine was different enough to no longer qualify for whatever machine my license covered. Quick to straighten out, though.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Amiga City - The BBS for the Amiga - more than 2,500+ files
  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Chai on Wednesday, June 27, 2018 12:04:00
    On 06-26-18 16:54, Chai wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    @VIA: VERT/AMIGAC
    Vk3jed wrote to Chai <=-

    32GB works for me on Android, and my old iPhone is a 64GB model (but
    that one has a lot of music on it).


    That's probably what I will go with. I *almost* manage with 16GB, so I think 32GB would be enough, for now.

    If I had music on the Android, I'd have to go bigger, or use an SD card for the music. :)


    ... Chopped cabbage-it's not just a good idea...it's THE SLAW
    --- MultiMail/Win v0.51
    þ Synchronet þ Freeway BBS, Bendigo Australia. freeway.apana.org.au
  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to Chai on Wednesday, June 27, 2018 12:30:00
    On 06-26-18 16:25, Chai wrote to Jagossel <=-

    Fills up your phone storage quicker. Forces people to buy, yet
    another, more expensive phone. It urks me too. I don't like things
    being so disposable. It's bad for the environment.

    I'm with you on this one. Crapware is literally a waste. On a PC with multi terabyte storage, who cares? But on a mobile device with limited storage, it is an issue.


    ... Omens are there to be broken.
    --- MultiMail/Win v0.51
    þ Synchronet þ Freeway BBS, Bendigo Australia. freeway.apana.org.au
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Chai on Thursday, June 28, 2018 06:31:54
    Re: Re: Smartphones
    By: Chai to Nightfox on Wed Jun 27 2018 01:41 am

    about a law that went into effect here some years ago where it's now
    technically illegal to throw away electronics into the garbage.

    My local garbage pickup allows electronics below a certain size (roughly a tower PC) in the recycling, and they sort it out. Very helpful.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Hawkeye on Thursday, June 28, 2018 06:34:28
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Hawkeye to poindexter FORTRAN on Wed Jun 27 2018 12:12 pm

    I had the same! I can't imagine running those machines now in my bedroom. When a kid i didnt worry and i slept good, now i dont want any sound near me :)

    I liked the white noise. Now I've got tinnitus, probably couldn't hear the PC running...

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Nightfox on Thursday, June 28, 2018 07:14:48
    Re: Digital Entitlements
    By: Nightfox to Chai on Wed Jun 27 2018 09:28 am

    I'm wondering what happens if you upgrade your CPU. Does your Windows license become invalidated and you need to buy a new copy of Windows, or does Microsoft allow re-use when your CPU is upgraded?

    You have to call them, and they make a note of it, and enable the activation.

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Vk3jed on Thursday, June 28, 2018 07:17:43
    Re: Re: Smartphones
    By: Vk3jed to Chai on Wed Jun 27 2018 12:04 pm

    If I had music on the Android, I'd have to go bigger, or use an SD card for the music. :)

    I keep my music, videos, Kindle and Audible apps and store my podcasts on the SD card, Works well.

    I can't believe I ever used a 16GB iPhone before!

    ---
    þ Synchronet þ realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to poindexter FORTRAN on Friday, June 29, 2018 07:29:00
    On 06-28-18 07:17, poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    @VIA: VERT/REALITY
    Re: Re: Smartphones
    By: Vk3jed to Chai on Wed Jun 27 2018 12:04 pm

    If I had music on the Android, I'd have to go bigger, or use an SD card
    or
    the music. :)

    I keep my music, videos, Kindle and Audible apps and store my podcasts
    on the SD card, Works well.

    Cool. With the iPhone dying, I may have to do the same on Android. :)

    I can't believe I ever used a 16GB iPhone before!

    Hahaha!


    ... I had a cat once... tasted like chicken.
    --- MultiMail/Win v0.51
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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to poindexter FORTRAN on Friday, June 29, 2018 17:20:00
    On 06-28-18 06:34, poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Hawkeye <=-

    I had the same! I can't imagine running those machines now in my bedroom. When a kid i didnt worry and i slept good, now i dont want any sound near me :)

    I liked the white noise. Now I've got tinnitus, probably couldn't hear
    the PC running...

    Yeah the white noise worked for me as well. :) Today, Iactually have a white noise generator in my Pi - one disadvantage of no moving parts! :) The generator is simply a cron job that plays a very long MP3 between 9PM and 8AM. :)


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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Vk3jed on Friday, June 29, 2018 06:28:29
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to poindexter FORTRAN on Fri Jun 29 2018 05:20 pm

    Yeah the white noise worked for me as well. :) Today, Iactually have a white noise generator in my Pi - one disadvantage of no moving parts! :) The generator is simply a cron job that plays a very long MP3 between 9PM and 8AM. :)

    oh, that's funny. For the full effect you should have it randomly play a clunking noise to freak you out and think that your spinning hard drive is going south.

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  • From Vk3jed@VERT/FREEWAY to poindexter FORTRAN on Saturday, June 30, 2018 08:25:00
    On 06-29-18 06:28, poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    oh, that's funny. For the full effect you should have it randomly play
    a clunking noise to freak you out and think that your spinning hard
    drive is going south.

    Hahaha, I'll pass on that. :)


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  • From Hawkeye@VERT/MASHBBS to Nightfox on Saturday, June 30, 2018 15:20:32
    Re: Digital Entitlements
    By: Nightfox to Chai on Wed Jun 27 2018 09:28:28

    I'm wondering what happens if you upgrade your CPU. Does your Windows license become invalidated and you need to buy a new copy of Windows, or does Microsoft allow re-use when your CPU is upgraded?

    Its all written in documents but you can swap 3 components and still use the same license, actually of you swap out more you can manually request a new license key which normally will be given, reason PC broke/stolen,etc...

    You can even connect your license to your Microsoft account and decide on which PC to activate, so decide which PC has which license, being more flexible. So in this case its not connected to a PC but to a person, for me this works fine.

    HAWKEYE

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  • From Hawkeye@VERT/MASHBBS to poindexter FORTRAN on Saturday, June 30, 2018 15:23:00
    Re: Re: Smartphones
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Chai on Thu Jun 28 2018 06:31:54

    about a law that went into effect here some years ago where it's now
    technically illegal to throw away electronics into the garbage.
    My local garbage pickup allows electronics below a certain size (roughly a tower PC) in the recycling, and they sort it out. Very helpful.

    Here in the Netherlands, Maastricht, we have a special rule. Does it have it's original power cord you can but it in a special garbage for free.

    HAWKEYE

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  • From Hawkeye@VERT/MASHBBS to poindexter FORTRAN on Saturday, June 30, 2018 15:23:29
    Re: Re: Media
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Hawkeye on Thu Jun 28 2018 06:34:28

    I liked the white noise. Now I've got tinnitus, probably couldn't hear the PC running...

    Same here :(

    HAWKEYE

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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Vk3jed on Sunday, July 01, 2018 00:34:02
    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to poindexter FORTRAN on Fri Jun 29 2018 05:20 pm

    On 06-28-18 06:34, poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Hawkeye <=-

    I had the same! I can't imagine running those machines now in my bedroom. When a kid i didnt worry and i slept good, now i dont want any sound near me :)

    I liked the white noise. Now I've got tinnitus, probably couldn't hear the PC running...

    Yeah the white noise worked for me as well. :) Today, Iactually have a white noise generator in my Pi - one disadvantage of no moving parts! :)
    The generator is simply a cron job that plays a very long MP3 between 9PM and 8AM. :)

    i have tinnitus, but that doesnt block out any sound. i just have the ringing/high pitch buzzing sound most of the time.

    i am so used to used to sleeping with my computers, it doesnt seem right without the sound of those fans spinning.

    i tried white noise mp3s for my tinnitus but they were more annoying to me than the sound.
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  • From Digital Man@VERT to MRO on Saturday, June 30, 2018 23:09:46
    Re: Re: Media
    By: MRO to Vk3jed on Sun Jul 01 2018 12:34 am

    Re: Re: Media
    By: Vk3jed to poindexter FORTRAN on Fri Jun 29 2018 05:20 pm

    On 06-28-18 06:34, poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Hawkeye <=-

    I had the same! I can't imagine running those machines now in my bedroom. When a kid i didnt worry and i slept good, now i dont want any sound near me :)

    I liked the white noise. Now I've got tinnitus, probably couldn't hear the PC running...

    Yeah the white noise worked for me as well. :) Today, Iactually have a white noise generator in my Pi - one disadvantage of no moving parts! :) The generator is simply a cron job that plays a very long MP3 between 9PM and 8AM. :)

    i have tinnitus, but that doesnt block out any sound. i just have the ringing/high pitch buzzing sound most of the time.

    Right, but that ringing in your ears masks sounds of the same frequency.

    i am so used to used to sleeping with my computers, it doesnt seem right without the sound of those fans spinning.

    i tried white noise mp3s for my tinnitus but they were more annoying to me than the sound.

    That's because the mp3s you were using did not match the frequency of your tinnitus (which can change from day to day or hour to hour). I use an app on my phone and you have to tune it to match your tinnitus and then the sound from the app completely disappears (to me), while everyone else around hears it loud and clear (if you're headphones are unplugged). It's pretty amazing.

    digital man

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  • From Jagossel@VERT/MTLGEEK to MRO on Sunday, July 01, 2018 08:55:12
    Re: Re: Media
    By: MRO to Vk3jed on Sun Jul 01 2018 00:34:02

    Yeah the white noise worked for me as well. :) Today, Iactually have a white noise generator in my Pi - one disadvantage of no moving parts! :) The generator is simply a cron job that plays a very long MP3 between 9PM and 8AM. :)

    i tried white noise mp3s for my tinnitus but they were more annoying to me t the sound.

    I have an app for my Android device called "Chromadoze". I use it to drown out the noise around me on days where I'm pretty sensitive about noises. It'll let you control a band of frequencies to your liking. For me, I have it the loudest in the lower frequencies and quiter on the higher frequencies.

    Maybe take a look? I do know that Chromadoze is open spurce as well. It should be available of Google Play and F-Droid.

    -jag
    Code it, Script it, Automate it!

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